The Jets need a "sexy" offensive pick

Discussion in 'Draft' started by GangGreenNYJ, Feb 16, 2017.

  1. JetsNation06

    JetsNation06 Well-Known Member

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    I'm actually leaning to Cook over Fournette as well. He's got some Devonta Freeman to his game and if we can add a weapon like that then he instantly helps our O in a big way.
     
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  2. xxedge72x

    xxedge72x Well-Known Member

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    I'm of the opinion that this is a great draft to trade down in. If the Jets dropped to 10-14 they'll still end up with an excellent player and bolster their picks.

    Also; many of the best teams rarely make sexy picks. If the best guy available is a safety, take him.
     
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  3. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I have to strongly disagree with the bolded sentence. IMO one should "never say 'never.'" Yes it turned out well in Williams' case, but it also could have quite possibly worked out well if Mac had taken Vic Beasley, Todd Gurley, Devante Parker, Marcus Peters or traded down and taken some other players. If Mac were to take Allen, I think he should be fired on the spot and not even allowed to finish the draft. I wouldn't even allow him to clean out his desk. Security would do that for him. Unless they're switching the D full time to the 4-3, they have zero needs on the DL. Meanwhile, they have a TON of other needs. Even if something were to happen to Mo or Williams later to justify the pick, it would still be a horrible move and send a horrible message to Jets fans.

    We've already seen that with the 3 great DL we have that they can't successfully be on the field together, and Bowles has resorted to playing one of them out of position to try to accomplish that. IMO drafting Allen would do little to improve the team, would be a criminal offense, and Mac should never work in the NFL again. We have HUGE needs at QB, LT, RB, TE, C, OLB, FS, #1 CB, ILB, maybe at SS, and if we trade or release Brandon Marshall, at #1 WR. We could quite possibly have the opportunity to draft either a QB, RB, TE, FS, #1CB, ILB, SS, or #1 WR at #6, any of which could have a HUGE impact on our team's fortunes going forward. He'd damn well better not bypass that opportunity and take yet another DL.
     
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  4. xxedge72x

    xxedge72x Well-Known Member

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    I can't agree with your sentiment here. Yes, Vic Beasley would've been a great pick. Gurley / Parker? Puke. Peters... meh.

    Leonard is the best player on the Jets. He is now a foundational piece of this team's future, and this is a good thing. Yes, the Jets could've Maddened there way to a better situation, but in real life the draft is the breaker of careers. Given his options, MacCagnan made a solid decision here.
     
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  5. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I'm glad to see you show some concern about the number of carries. I've been surprised that of the few responses I had in my thread regarding RB carries, that none have really talked about the point of the thread, i.e., the number of carries some RBs have. There are a couple of RBs in this draft that I wouldn't have on my draft board until the 6th or 7th round because of the number of carries they've already had. Kareem Hunt has already had 782 carries. They were spread out over 4 years, but that's still a lot of carries. Donnel Pumphrey has had an insane 1,059 carries even though they were spread out over 4 years. Kenneth Dixon had 802 carries in 4 years. I don't think those guys will last long in the NFL. They may not even make the 3-year average for RBs.

    I've only seen Kamara play once, and haven't seen Marlon Mack, De'Veon Smith, D'Onta Foreman, Corey Clement, Jeremy McNichols, or Matthew Dayes play at all, but I think those are the RBs (and maybe Joe Mixon if he's as some posters have portrayed him) that Mac ought to be looking at closely if he's not seriously considering Cook.

    Even though Hill had moderate carries the previous two years, as you said 350 carries in one season is insane. The same goes for how Fournette was handled his sophomore season. If Hill isn't already having health issues, they could crop up sooner rather than later. Maybe as part of a platoon with Powell and Forte, he or some of the others with a lot of carries already would be OK, but I think it is something that should be strongly considered.
     
  6. WW85

    WW85 MOCKERATOR
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    You and I agree to disagree which is fine. Williams , IMO is a better player than Beasley, Gurley and Parker. Mac took the BPA available and it has worked out. I was talking with the premise of how Mac thinks when it comes to the draft, I'm taking the Jet Fan emotion out of the equation, that Allen could be a possibility. Do I want Allen??, not really, I would prefer Foster, Adams, Cook or M. Williams (if Marshall is gone). IMO, there is no QB, CB worth drafting at #6. I know we disagree on Hooker, I've seen his entire very short career in Columbus and he's a good player but slightly overrated and needs more experience. I like Adams leadership and upside more. People saying Adams can't cover and play deep is wrong, his strength is closer to the line, but can cover well too.

    I blame Bowles for the stupidity of using Richardson out of position, I was furious with that decision.
     
  7. RubenDias

    RubenDias Well-Known Member

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    Jamal Adams and Reuben Foster are my favorite players at # 6 as well but for example i rather take Malik Hooker or Marshon Lattimore or even Fournette over Allen unless you tell me we can get a 2nd round pick for Mo wilkerson and a 3rd for sheldon.
     
  8. Lenny and THE JETS

    Lenny and THE JETS Well-Known Member

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    why?
     
  9. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it's fine that we disagree. I know it's always mutually respectful on the occasions that we disagree. I agree that Williams is better than the players you mentioned, and as I said it worked out well with Williams, but imo it would work out much less well this time. Even if we trade Sheldon, that still leaves too many DL to get on the field at the same time, and would have too much money tied up on the DL, especially considering that the DL isn't even the most important unit in a 3-4 D alignment. So even if Allen were head and shoulders better than any other player at #6, the Jets shouldn't even consider him. They should either trade down if a trade partner can be found, or take the 2nd best player. IMO taking Allen would not improve the team one bit. There is no emotion in that thinking either. It's purely based on economics and consideration of the value of 3-4 DL along with Jets needs. I would think the same way if we were talking about any other team in the NFL.

    I know that you were looking at it from Mac's perspective, and you're probably right that is how he sees it. If you are right, and that is indeed how he sees things, then imo he isn't the right GM for the Jets and should be fired along with Bowles at the end of the 2017 season.

    While our offense is in dire need of attention, I'm not one who will go ape if Mac takes a defensive player at #6, but if he does, it had better be Foster, Adams, Garrett if he falls, or maybe Hooker, and not Allen. I don't like take RBs this high, but Cook may be to good and too good of a fit for the Jets' new offense to pass up. Barring him, I think I'd like to see them trade down a few spots and grab Howard.

    Regarding Hooker, I respect and trust your opinion. I've only seen a little video on him and read a number of scouting reports and what some fans of his here have posted. He sounds like a great prospect, but with the surgeries and only 1 year starting experience, he is risky.

    I like Adams a lot. I agree that people are wrong who say that Adams can't cover that well. I've seen him do it time and again. He has good speed and is a good tackler. I think the thing I like even more than those things are his leadership and how he makes those around him better. He could be huge for the Jets' D. I forget what you think of Pryor. Did you ever like him? If so, do you still? Would you consider taking Adams and trading Pryor, or would you try Adams at FS?
     
  10. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 Well-Known Member

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    I find Adams playing FS to be a waste of a good player's talents. He's a great tackler, good cover guy, but why would you want him to waste his great talent playing single high safety?
     
  11. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I don't know that his talents would be wasted there, but he may not have the same impact as he would at SS. At FS you need a player who is good in coverage and is a good tackler as your last line of defense. The only reasons I would do that are because we already have Pryor, and we have a big need at FS. We have a 1st round pick invested in Pryor, and he did play pretty darn well in 2015. Taking Adams and trading Pryor could very well upgrade the SS position, but the overall impact on the team would be less than taking Reuben Foster or another of the top players at #6.

    Unless I was convinced that Pryor couldn't return to his 2015 level of play and stay there consistently, and was planning on trading him, I probably wouldn't take Adams at all. If I had doubts about Pryor, then I might take Adams and try him at FS in the 2017 season and see if I could get Pryor playing the way he did in 2015. If that was successful, we'd have one of the best safety tandems in the NFL. If Pryor didn't return to 2015 form or Adams struggled at FS, then I'd probably either try to trade Pryor prior to the trade deadline and move Adams back to SS, or just wait until the end of the season, and allow Pryor to leave via FA and move Adams back to SS for the 2018 season.
     
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  12. xxedge72x

    xxedge72x Well-Known Member

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    I don't know if the Jets can count on Pryor in their long term plans. If the pick comes up and he's the best player on the board, then take him and move on from Pryor next year.

    Sent from my KIW-L24 using Tapatalk
     
  13. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 Well-Known Member

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    Adams would be a huge upgrade over Pryor. As long as you schematically put them in position to make plays, I guess Pryor and Adams could co-exist. I would want Adams to be all over the field, helping in run support, making impact plays over the middle of the field also, that just seems like something we wanted Pryor to do when he was drafted. Adams can def play the role of that single high safety, but I just don't think it'll maximize his production / impact on the team. Hooker is the true single high center-fielder prospect, he has better range and ball hawk ability. Adams does everything else much better.

    I would be very happy to see Adams on this team. If we could get 1 of the 2 safeties it'll be a win in my opinion.
     
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  14. xxedge72x

    xxedge72x Well-Known Member

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    Serious, yet unrealistic question here...

    Let's say theoretically the Jets take Adams at 6, and then somewhere around pick 20-24 Hooker is still on the board thanks to his injury. Would you be opposed to the Jets moving up from the 2nd round pick to nab him too? Say, using Pryor and/or Richardson as trade bait?

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  15. b.reyes16

    b.reyes16 Well-Known Member

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    Can't run too effectively if you're hit in the backfield every play. Guy breaks more tackles than anyone in the nation. LSU has one of the poorer o-lines in the SEC.
     
  16. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely, even if Hooker isn't on the board, I would love to see if the Jets can move up and get back into the first. 2nd rounders are a curse anyway ... that would be the perfect time to select a lineman. Sheldon and or Pryor need to go IMO, awful attitudes.
     
  17. LAJet

    LAJet Well-Known Member

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    When it comes time to draft choices for the Jets I invariably defer and support the top knowledgeable members right here at TGG over most every walkie-talkie analyst out in the media. There is a select group of members among us that live and breed Jet football and really do their homework when it comes to the draft. My hat is off to them.
    Can't help but think going back to the Idzik nightmare draft that had he used a mock draft from one of our guys over what he chose we would be light years ahead right now. So as this draft approaches I keep my eyes on the recommendations of this board.
    IMO, without presuming to remotely understand the relative strength and ranking of players, I think Mac will look at every pick based on maximum value not necessarily for immediate but more importantly for future and continuing strength.
    I honestly believe this year he will pull a fast one on us. He is probably negotiating as we speak for some potential trade down possibilities. I also think that he knows the draft is full of very talented defensive players so if the margin of difference is small, between rounds 1-3, he might target something different, a game changer on offense that might not be there past the first round.
    If I were a betting man, and Garrett/Foster are off the board, he might go Cook, a guy that could be our RB for the next 10 years and be a force to reckon with. Cook and Powell would form a formidable tandem that would take a massive load off of our QB. Add D,TE and OL on the remaining rounds and hopefully a jewel on the undrafted column.
    Then again when it comes to the draft what the hell do I know. I defer to my TGG draft gurus.
     
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  18. KurtTheJetsFan

    KurtTheJetsFan Well-Known Member

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    I am backing off alittle from "offense or bust" at 6...but it's gotta be for a speed/athleticism upgrade to the back 7. While Adams does alot of things well... I'd still prefer Hooker & give him the very simple role of keeping everything in front of him & giving a legit top to this defense. You can still throw over Adams head...There's been too much of that crap from this Jets secondary.
     
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  19. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 Well-Known Member

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    The Jets secondary is the worst I've seen in a long time. The end of the 2015 season, Jets allowed 15 touchdown passes of 20+ yards, most in the NFL. 2016, that number I believe was even worse. Every game, first play was a deep shot down the field for a touchdown. 52 20+ yard plays down the field on the Jets defense this past season with a 30 to 8 TD / INT ratio. That's New Orlean Saints territory. I think Hooker could truly help get rid of those deep passes down the field. He has the speed, range and ball hawk ability. I like Adams too, but he's no Eric Berry IMO. Berry, I remember watching him and he seemed to be a far better cover guy.

    Believe me, I am sick of drafting defense year after year, but the Jets need to re-haul the secondary otherwise it doesn't matter who the QB is when you are losing 41 to 38 each and every week cause you can't protect the back-end. I like Cook a lot at RB, or Watson at QB, but the options at the top are very limited. No lineman available that are that good in the top 10. If the Jets can trade down, I'm all for an offensive player.
     
  20. NYJetsO12

    NYJetsO12 Well-Known Member

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    LOL

    people on TGG want Fournette in the worst way while our OL is in shambles
     
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