Qb needs help dummies

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by sec314, Jun 16, 2017.

  1. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    I am concerned with the lack of experience. I like some of the young kids but getting rid of a vet like decker is gonna hurt. If hack or Petty start having vets would help them. I am also a recovering addicti. Relax I could not remember his name. I am rooting for him but he's a big question mark
     
  2. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    Who said I had faith. I said I have not given up because he has not hit the field. My concern is with experience with the young players not talent. Nice post. Thanks
     
  3. TouchyFeely

    TouchyFeely Well-Known Member

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    You don't draft OL in a draft class with few highly rated linemen. It just sets you back when you need to cut guys who don't work out and need to draft more lineman later on when you could be filling out other position groups. We've drafted OL to develop over the last few years, obviously not all of them have worked out but you can't draft linemen every year and neglect other more highly rated position groups every draft.
     
  4. DefenseWinsChampionships

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    Well said and i strongly agree.

    The 1st O-Lineman was not drafted until the 20th selection by Denver.

    If N.Y would have drafted an O-Lineman at 6th overall and passed up on a Jamal Adams type of prospect... we all would have lost it and gone absolute ape shit.

    I personally wanted Dalvin Cook as an FSU fan but the same goes for our 2nd round draft selection in Marcus Maye. After NY drafted Maye, the next offensive lineman was not drafted unti another 19 picks later (by Seattle).

    I can understand wanting to beef up our trenches but 2017 was not the draft to do so. Unless you were looking to reach. Which would have been an awful idea; to reach.

    Even with our 3rd round selection in ArDarius Stewart, WR out of Alabama. The next O-Lineman was not drafted until 6 picks later out of Troy University... And that O-Lineman from Troy just so happened to be the final O-Lineman drafted during the 3rd round.

    And Chad Hansen (WR) appeared to be one of the best value draftings of the 4th round (production wise) and I'm really not sure which O-Lineman that Maccagnan was expected to pull the trigger on right then and there... Because the next O-Lineman after Hansen was not drafted until 6 picks later from a college called "Kutztown". Huh? Where? All i know is that it's a Division II school.

    Really not sure how anyone could complain about not drafting O-Line throughout 2017's draft when it was rich in talent with skilled player positions.
     
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  5. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    You do know that this recent draft was a lousy one for OL, don't you? It was supposedly one of the worst in a long time. You don't draft OL out of need in a draft where the OL are not that good. You draft to the strength of the draft. This draft was strong and deep at CB, TE, RB, OLB, WR and S. If you'll notice, Mac took players from every single one of those position groups and eschewed the weaker position groups.

    Yes, the OL needs to be addressed, but you can't do it in a draft where there aren't quality prospects. It would be stupid to reach out of need for lesser players on the OL instead of taking much higher rated/better players at other positions. I feel very confident that Mac will address the OL in FA and the draft next year.
     
  6. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    From a school where it's clear that it was the QB that carried the team, not the other way around. And the latter is why so many "big time" programs produce busts. It's still way to early to predict, but based on my criteria the kid from Wyoming would seem like the stronger bet - when was the last National Championship Wyoming won?
     
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  7. LV Coach

    LV Coach Well-Known Member

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    I agree with those who think our OL will be better then last year. The right side is set and Beachum is more then adequate. They should give who ever is QB enough time to check on 3 of the WR's before dumping off to a back. The TE' are better then we've had and with out new OC they will be in the game plan. Don't know how many we'll win, but they should be in about 3/4's of our schedule.
     
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  8. DefenseWinsChampionships

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    That's a fair question in regards to Wyoming as a program but you can not be hypocritical at the same time.

    You're asking when's the last time Wyoming won a title, but yet, you were also asking when's the last time a USC QB won an NFL SB... You can't have it both ways.

    And most of the times the top rated H.S QB's end up going to powerhouse NCAA programs because they're the highest rated QB's within the Nation. That's why they sign with powerhouses to begin with.

    One could even argue USC QB's have had more NFL success than QB's from Wyoming etc. Not a good way to judge this QB class. Not at all.

    Should N.E, Indy & San Fran never have drafted Brady, Manning & Montana all because Michigan, Tennessee & Notre Dame has produced NFL busts within the past?

    That's just crazy.

    My team is FSU. Florida State has not always been known for developing great NFL QB's on the next level, but that still did not stop Tampa Bay from drafting Jameis Winston 1st overall. That kid was just different. And now look. The Bucs now have a young franchise QB (to build arond) and one who's still only 23 years of age and an absolute STUD.

    So TB should not have drafted Winston out of FSU due to NFL QB failures before him?

    That's an insane thought process.

    The likes of Mark Sanchez of USC has zero to do with Sam Darnold of 2017. First and foremost Darnold has much better size and the numbers that Sanchez put up as a 1st year starting Junior aren't even better than what Darnold put up as a Freshman.

    I have my questions about Darnold as a QB. Can he play in ugly Northeastern Weather etc

    But to write off a top prospect, due to previous failures from many of years ago all because of the same school name is pretty stupid.
     
  9. The Waterboy

    The Waterboy Well-Known Member

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    When is the last time a high priced RB led his team to a Super Bowl victory? Best to put that money towards the O Line and just draft a RB every few years or grab a lower priced FA RB.
     
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  10. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    There is more to the draft then the first round. So not one ol in the 2017 draft will start. You guys just copy what other people say. We ignored ol and cb. I guess there was not one Cb either
     
  11. TouchyFeely

    TouchyFeely Well-Known Member

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    Felt the need to drop back in. No one said there were NO linemen worth taking, but no linemen our FO thought were WORTH taking at our draft positions compared to other players. There are few players who you know are going to be studs.

    Two linemen were drafted in the first, but I wouldn't take either one over Adams.

    Two more were taken in the second before our pick, Cam Robinson and Forrest Lamp, Robinson has starting LT potential and Forrest Lamp was actually the highest rated lineman overall (by me and others) but is a bit undersized for tackle. I'd have been fine with drafting either of these guys with our second round pick because of Robinson's potential at a position of need and I believe Lamp can legitimately start anywhere on the front 5 despite his height and length. Unfortunately, as I said, they were already gone. A center and two more guards went at the end of the second, however our guard situation is our most entrenched and safe so it's not really a need. A center may have been a good pick if we didn't draft a guy who is expected to be our starting safety that allowed us to shed an under performing and communication hazard in Pryor.

    Third round we traded down and two linemen went right at our pick. C and G again. Why didn't we draft a center here? Maybe we like Wesley Johnson? Maybe we didn't like Pat Elflein? Regardless, there was a reason. We went on to draft Ardarius Stewart, and in hindsight, with the release of Decker and Brandon Marshall, I'm guessing we knew we needed some bodies at WR. The next tackle went off the board 6 picks later. (In all seriousness, I'd rather have drafted Chris Godwin here (who is now receiving Roddy White comparisons in camp) than Ardarius Stewart or any potential linemen left on the board.

    From here on out we started our trading down jamboree. To an uninformed onlooker, this tells me guys that we liked were getting picked ahead of where we thought we were going to, liked guys who were thought to go much later, or didn't like that many more players overall. 6 linemen went in the fourth round, of which I've watched 4 play, and I only like 1 of those 4 as a prospect. Jets nabbed Chad Hansen towards the end to fill out some WR depth.

    In the fifth round we're to the point that we're scrapping the bottom of the barrel of linemen prospects. Names like Roderick Johnson, who at 6'7 300lbs got bullied the entire collegiate season. Instead we grab Jordan Leggett, with a great TE frame, soft hands and hopefully some fire to improve as a blocker and become a safety valve down the road. I'd have preferred George Kittle, but he went a few picks before our spot. Finished out with drafting an unknown in Dylan Donahue who our new OLB coach, 3 time All-Pro Kevin Greene, has taken under his wing and is over performing what was thought to be a depth and special team guy.

    Sixth round we've got 3 picks from all the trading down before and during. We grab a third RB and two CBs with big frames and athleticism to mold.

    Now your cornerback question is legitimate. This was a great draft for CB in my opinion and I think we waited too long to draft a couple. However, the fact that we double dipped at safety rounds 1 and 2 may mean the CBs weren't entirely at fault last year. Pryor and Gilchrist really shit the bed for us to get rid of both of them and replace them with rooks. Sure Revis looked like he lost a step, and we brought in Claiborne to replace him. Juston Burris played decent in limited time and is expected to be the second corner on the outside as he's seemingly passed Marcus Williams on the depth chart, moving Buster Skrine to the slot in nickel. Does our FO and coaching staff think they can handle it with two potential stud rookies backing them up?

    We're rebuilding. It's a process. It's ignorant to think you can simply draft for need every year at any particular position without looking at the individual prospects AS WELL AS alternative prospects at other positions at a particular draft spot.
     
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  12. twown

    twown Well-Known Member

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    If there's one thing we have in this organization, it's help dummies. Everyone is trying to help in their own moronic way.
     
  13. NYJalltheway

    NYJalltheway Well-Known Member

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    Thank God. We'll just simply sign Carr, Bell, and Hopkins.

    This is great news!
     
  14. TonyFtLaud

    TonyFtLaud Well-Known Member

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    Lynch would be the last to do it, would have been back to back if Carol didn't make the worst play call in Superbowl history .
    Freeman is a special player and would be a great addition to the WCO. Excellent hands and a serious threat on 3 Rd down. The market is not that high for RBs in general. What pro bowl caliber OL player on second contract do you foresee hitting the market in 2018?
     
  15. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Just because there may be an OL who will start doesn't mean that we should have taken him. GMs who draft solely out of need don't last long and their teams don't do very well. There has to be a balance of need and best player available. The Jets had nothing at S, and great safety prospects are rare. I was surprised and a little disappointed that a CB wasn't taken earlier, but let 's see how things work out. All of our needs weren't getting filled this year anyway. Just because he didn't value positions in the order you do, doesn't mean that Mac is wrong.
     
    #35 NCJetsfan, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
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  16. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Overall, a good post that I mostly agree with, but I disagree with you about both Robinson and Lamp. Neither one can play LT imo, and Lamp can't play RT, either. IMO Lamp is an OG or C. IMO Robinson is a RT or OG.
     
  17. TonyFtLaud

    TonyFtLaud Well-Known Member

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    Excellent post. I loved the Dylan Donahue pick. NCAA all time tackle leader ,loves the game and can play. I think he is going to surprise.
    Also Mac tried to trade up in round 2 for Kevin King. He let the draft come to him and most importantly, didn't reach.
     
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  18. The Waterboy

    The Waterboy Well-Known Member

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    15 rushes for 39 yards, hardly leading his team to Super Bowl victory. Ask most people and they will say the defense is what got them to and was instrumental in the SB victory, most aren't' going to put Lynch as the top factor..

    As far as what O linemen I expect to be available next year, it's hard to say but if Robinson or Joeckel have a solid season they will be worth taking a look at, Collins is certainly worth a look at.

    But my point wasn't who would be available next year, it was that if you build a solid line it pays dividends above just signing a high priced RB. You said yourself, "The market is not that high for RBs in general", why do you think that is?
     
  19. pdxdrew

    pdxdrew Well-Known Member

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    Good news is that we have a really good OL coach. I still wish we had someone better starting at LT though. It will either be Ijalana or Beachum. I don't want Hack to get blindsided when he DOES try to make a decent pass.
     
  20. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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