Mike M. has to go

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by jets12, Sep 2, 2017.

  1. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Mo, I'm with you to an extent. I don't want a rookie GM coming in having little or no time to prepare for FA and the draft especially for such a critical draft for the Jets. The thing is, I've lost most of my faith/trust and confidence in Mac. Even if the Jets get the #1 pick, at this point, it wouldn't surprise me if Mac was still determined to show that Hack was going to be our FQB, and see him totally passing on any of the QBs in the draft. If there's a stud DE/OLB edge rusher in the draft, it wouldn't surprised me to see Mac take him #1, add a CB, and ILB or two and maybe a RB in a mid round and once again give the offense short shrift.
     
  2. TwoHeadedMonster

    TwoHeadedMonster Well-Known Member

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    I think this is a pretty awful evaluation.

    Exactly what does a second-year 4th-round CB or 7th round WR have to do to qualify as a "Hit", "Miss", or "Toss up"?
     
  3. JethroTull

    JethroTull 2018 Least Knowledgeable Poster

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    Can we at least all agree his two drafts have sucked?
     
  4. JethroTull

    JethroTull 2018 Least Knowledgeable Poster

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    There is zero chance that happens. Woody is going to want a star QB to help sell PSLs.
     
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  5. IdziksGhost

    IdziksGhost New Member

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    I have no problem at all if they get rid of Mac. That said, this stupid power structure that was setup by our moron owner Woody is the real problem here. I mean, do we even know who is making the actual personnel calls for the Jets? Everyone assumes its the GM, because traditionally that is what a GM does, but damn, I have seen more than enough evidence that many of the moves were Bowles moves. From declaring Fitz the starter before he's signed, to talking about why they took Lee, and on and on. Woody is the real problem, and until he changes his ways, nothing will ever change with this organization. We argue about Rex, Bowles, Idzik, Mac,....... But the one constant through all the stupidity is Woody.
     
  6. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

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    I agree, the power structure is really unorthodox. The coach answers to the GM, GM to owner, or head of football ops. Macc and Bowles should not be on equal footing. I don't suspect that they aren't working in tandem, I happen to think some of Macc's draft picks indicate both Bowles and Macc work together, but going forward, assuming both are let go, I would prefer Jets return to a traditional power structure. The GM should be running the coaching search.
     
  7. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

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    Steelers have the same type of structure, but well Rooneys know football ... how many HCs in franchise history have they had?
     
  8. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

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    Not many, and yes I know Woody is not the best or most intelligent football owner, but I would say that really if we are gonna get rid of the both of them can we at least let the GM pick his head coach. So we can have two people with high positions working on a plan, all draft picks follow that plan, etc. It's a tandem job, not a we look at you separately kind of deal IMO.
     
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  9. IdziksGhost

    IdziksGhost New Member

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    At a bare minimum, we need a czar of football ops who ultimately is responsible for the product on the field. I don't care if it is the coach, or the GM, assuming they are qualified, or a head of football ops, but we need one guy whose name does not start with W and end with a y responsible and accountable for football decisions.
     
  10. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

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    Yep and the reality of the situation is we will have 80+ million in cap, a top 3-5 pick in all rounds. I hope Chris and Woody open up the check book cause we're gonna need to get someone who knows how to run a football team on this team.
     
  11. BigSnacks54

    BigSnacks54 Well-Known Member

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    Serious question: After 2 seasons, soon to be three seasons in December, what has Mike M done better than Idzik ? Spend all of the cap space Idzik created? Handle media pressers better? Here, we have the "scout" producing drafts just as mediocre as Idzik, his free agent signings flopped, caved in to signing Fitzpatrick and took a UDFA quality QB prospect in round 2, when it was clear to everyone that Christian Hackenberg was simply incompetent. Yet, fans here continue to give him benefit of doubt, instead, placing most of them blame on Bowles. The Jets blew up their regime three years ago- they're arguably in a worse position than they were three years- that doesn't just fall on the coach.
     
  12. IdziksGhost

    IdziksGhost New Member

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    Heres the thing, Idzik had what seemed like free reign over the draft picks, and Rex was rightfully held away. Idzik passed on what looks like 3 franchise QB's to take a safety out of the league right now.

    I have very much disliked the draft choices for the most part for Mac as well, but, I really believe that Mac is more geared towards getting Bowles what he wants rather than picking the guys he wants. I could be wrong, but I am basing that on many comments I have read over the few drafts.

    I have no problem with Mac being gone at the end of the year at all, but I personally do believe he has drafted largely what Bowles wanted him to draft, much like early on Tannenbaum drafted much of what Rex wanted him to draft.
     
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  13. BigSnacks54

    BigSnacks54 Well-Known Member

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    The Jets took Calvin Pryor, a hard hitting safety, throw back in the box safety in round 1? Mind you, this pick was made coming off the heels of the Seahawks dominant Superbowl 48 performance led by 2 top tier safeties in Kam Chancellor and Earl Thomas. Does a pick like that not suggest that Idzik was also making picks geared towards the desires of Rex? I would think that it is necessary for a HC/GM to be closely linked in regards to the draft- everyone loves BPA but you also do have to draft for scheme and who knows what's best for his scheme than the coaches themselves?

    Mac is clearly media savy and is far more adept at avoiding the "traps" of the vicious NY media than John Idzik ever was. And if mac keeps his job at the conclusion of the season, that characteristic of his will be the main reason why. I said it on draft night, but the selection of Hackenberg in round 2 was a legitimately fireable offense. That move was FAR worse than anything Idzik executed in his Jets tenure.
     
  14. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I agree. I think Woody and his stupid org chart are at the heart of it. After Idzik and Rex were at cross purposes and didn't work together, I think that Woody told both Bowles and Mac that they had better work together and that Mac better supply Bowles what he needed and not be accused of undercutting him like Idzik was with Rex. With both Bowles and Mac having Woody's ear, Woody being stupid and fickle/inconsistent in direction, I think it's entirely likely that Mac made a decision to basically give Bowles what he wants most of the time but to add a player here and there that he likes and wants for the team. In that way, he's letting Bowles hang himself. Bowles won't be able to say that Mac didn't support him and give him the players he needed. Bowles will be held accountable and fired, Mac will have won Woody's trust and then have more latitude with the draft, decisions and be able to hire the new HC who will then report to him. That may not be the case, but it makes more sense than some of the other things I've seen on this board, and that's why I think it's premature for posters to criticize Mac so harshly. We're not in his shoes. We don't know what Woody may or may not have told him behind the scenes and what the political landscape is like. He may be doing the best anyone could have done under the circumstances. I haven't liked or agree with every move. I think he has made mistakes. I am disappointed and have lost some trust and confidence in him, but that could be as much as anything because of all the negativity here, and Mac's not being able to reveal what's going on behind the scenes.

    I do know that if we fire him and he goes to another team, there's a very good chance we would rue firing him. With every fiber of my being, I believe that Bowles is incompetent and must go. I really wish that Woody would hire someone like Dorsey as Team President and Head of Football Operations, give him all the information on how decisions have been made and why, and let him make the determination on whether or not Mac should stay and get to hire the next HC.
     
    #194 NCJetsfan, Sep 15, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2017
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  15. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    So , it's easy for you to believe idzic drafted an in the box safety on his own accord and not have any input from the guy who 1, loves in the box safeties and 2 . Was forced on idzic when he took the job? Really? I mean really?
     
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  16. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    Idzik sucked and that's understandable. But we also never really got to see what he was going to do moving forward in free agency. He seemed to have a decent eye for veteran talent, and looked like he wanted to at least give it a go at signing free agents to build the offense. He signed Eric Decker and acquired Chris Ivory, both of which instantly became our two best offensive players.

    I'm not trying to defend him, but he and Maccagnan are pretty much shitty equals in terms of what they did in building this roster, although Idzik seemed to have more of a vision.

    If we wanted what Maccagnan brings to the table we should've just kept Tannenbaum. Gear up for a two year run and then tear it all completely down immediately after it fails.

    Idzik had a record of 12-20 as general manager without a gigantic spending budget as he had to rebuild the cap situation. Maccagnan has a record through two years of 14-18 with $70+ million spent on free agents prior to that 10-6 season.

    They're one in the same in their shitty selections.

    Idzik was also given stipulations that handcuffed us in our general manager search in being required to keep Rex and trade away Revis.

    Stipulations like that is what had potential general managers not even want to interview. I remember several did not even want to interview and I believe George Paton (assistant GM in Minnesota) was one of them.
     
  17. Zach

    Zach Well-Known Member

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    Welcome back, Champ. Still champing, eh?

    I missed you.

    :mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
     
  18. MoWilkBeast

    MoWilkBeast Well-Known Member

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    There's no problem with a dual reporting structure if the guy they are reporting to understands can create an overall plan for the team and has the experience and knowledge to accurately judge how well they are doing against that. If the owner can do that, then great, if they can't then they need someone in charge who can - be that a VP type role or by giving the GM full control.
     
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  19. IdziksGhost

    IdziksGhost New Member

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    Pretty much, yeah. If you read the stories, Idzik brought Pryor to Rex, not the other way around. Idzik loved him. In addition, most people believe that Idzik was trying to get rid of Rex to bring in his own HC. Also, Idzik had just drafted Geno Smith (I'm puking) which made him not draft Carr, Bridgewater or Garappalo.

    Bowles was hired before Maccagnan, not the other way around. And if you read the quotes and stories from Bowles, he makes a lot of the personnel moves pretty clear that he is behind them.

    I don't care one bit if Mac is gone, but getting rid of Mac, Bowles or both won't do anything until the structure is setup properly. Woody won't do it because he loves to meddle, and then he gets his people to take the blame for it, and fires whomever the fans want to see fired more.
     
  20. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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