MIchelle Carter Guilty of Involuntary Manslaughter

Discussion in 'BS Forum' started by jetophile, Jun 16, 2017.

  1. Yisman

    Yisman Newbie
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 3, 2004
    Messages:
    29,723
    Likes Received:
    1,053
    She actually acknowledged being responsible for his death.
     
  2. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    25,896
    Likes Received:
    26,648
    she researched how he could do it, talked him back into it after he expressed concerns numerous times, called him a pussy for not following through, told him his family would understand, told him he doesn't need help he needs to just kill himself, told him the night he did it that he needs to follow through for once, then told him to get back in the car when he changed his mind at the last minute, then was on the phone with him when he died.

    fuck this bitch. she gets what she deserves
     
    RuJFan likes this.
  3. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    14,034
    Likes Received:
    8,637
    And what forced the guy to do anything other than hang up his phone? Didn't your mother ever mention to you that just because someone tells you to do something, you don't have to do it. You know the old "If Johnny tells you to jump off the Brooklyn Bridge, are you going to do it?"
     
    JetBlue likes this.
  4. BrowningNagle

    BrowningNagle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2003
    Messages:
    25,896
    Likes Received:
    26,648
    at one point she complained to him that it was making her look really bad because she is telling others about it and that he hadn't killed himself yet
     
  5. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    14,034
    Likes Received:
    8,637
    Nowhere have I said she is not a despicable human being. I still believe her conviction will be reversed on appeal.
     
  6. IDFjet

    IDFjet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Messages:
    3,414
    Likes Received:
    2,485
    If she told him to kill someone and he did, she's guilty as hell.

    So if she tell him to kill himself she's not guilty?
     
  7. Faux machine

    Faux machine Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 17, 2012
    Messages:
    2,825
    Likes Received:
    2,091
    Charles Manson didn't kill anyone.
     
    IDFjet likes this.
  8. IDFjet

    IDFjet Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2014
    Messages:
    3,414
    Likes Received:
    2,485
    I saw the resemblance too but didn't know how to phrase it.
     
  9. jetophile

    jetophile Bruce Coslet's Daughter

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2004
    Messages:
    14,753
    Likes Received:
    8,208
    I hear you, but it's more complicated than that, obviously. He didn't hang up his phone. She listened to him struggling to die for 20 minutes when he got back in the truck after she goaded him into finishing himself off. No, he didn't have to listen, but I can't help feeling that all this kid wanted was for someone to talk him off the ledge. When she was fairly sure he was dead, she hung up, didn't call authorities, didn't call his parents, and then let her head rest comfortably on her pillow. She was a willing participant in a digital snuff film that she directed, then went on a pity party on social media over her poor, dead boyfriend. Munchausen by boyfriend, that is. The kicker was her involvement in suicide awareness.

    I'll re-iterate, this is an extremely slippery slope. Opens the door to really bad things (Word Crimes), but in a way, she got what the she wanted all along: attention. I hope to heaven that she never has a kid because you know how that's gonna wind up: several trips to the hospital and a questionable crib death. She should be held accountable for something, I'm just not sure what that is. Being forgotten would work.
     
    #29 jetophile, Jun 22, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2017
    RuJFan likes this.
  10. jetophile

    jetophile Bruce Coslet's Daughter

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2004
    Messages:
    14,753
    Likes Received:
    8,208
    Good parallel.
     
  11. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    14,034
    Likes Received:
    8,637
    Is it established where the events took place that one has a legal obligation to talk someone off the ledge or notify anyone of such an occurrence? Again, she may be living, breathing puke but I don't believe this will stand on appeal.
     
  12. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2004
    Messages:
    32,235
    Likes Received:
    30,552
    I agree in the sense that she should rot in jail. But it's a tough ruling because what does this precedent turn into? Anytime says 'hey go kill yourself' and the person does it, do they become liable?

    It's important that she lives a miserable life and a person who let someone else die without intervening will without a doubt have a terrible remainder of her life but I just wonder what this sets up for the American justice system and how anyone with minor thoughts of suicide that mentions it to someone does everyone become liable?
     
  13. Sam Hammer

    Sam Hammer Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2015
    Messages:
    2,995
    Likes Received:
    2,752
    It seems a bit much to give a teenage girl 20 years for encouraging suicide, I really hope they don't give her the max. I get that it was wrong and messed up, but there has to be a point where we look at what we are doing here. The girl needs mental help. That much is obvious. Get her the help she needs instead of just locking her for 20 years with criminals that committed REAL crimes. She's going to get eaten alive in there.

    This is just another reason why we are going downhill fast. 20 years is 1/4 - 1/3 of her life. What if she kills herself in prison? I just think it's a bit much. If she were a normal sane adult, I might think differently, but a 16 year old girl with psychological problems? Come on, people. She needs rehab not prison. The punishment doesn't fit the crime.
     
    #33 Sam Hammer, Jun 23, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2017
  14. JetBlue

    JetBlue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2004
    Messages:
    11,622
    Likes Received:
    5,835
    The punishment doesn't fit the crime because there is no crime. This was a ridiculously thin interpretation of reckless behavior to claim it applies to a charge of manslaughter.

    But why the hell did they refuse a trial jury and simply go before a judge. In a jury trial you only need to reason with one juror. With a judge, you get one imbecile and you are screwed. And if anyone has ever been before a judge, you know wearing a robe doesn't equate to rational or intelligent.
     
    Sam Hammer likes this.
  15. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    14,034
    Likes Received:
    8,637
    But does a jury always return a rational, intelligent or even legal verdict? A Cosby juror is being quoted as saying members of that panel decided he had suffered enough already. That is quite possibly true but it is not what the jury is charged with deciding. Looks like that judge did a lousy job of properly charging the jury.
     
  16. jetophile

    jetophile Bruce Coslet's Daughter

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2004
    Messages:
    14,753
    Likes Received:
    8,208
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Like she gave a crap. The level of attention seeking depravity is depraved. Carter raised $2,300.00 and no-one even knows what happened to the money. Naught to do with legal arguments, but this is just chilling. If you read the full text transcripts, it's beyond sick. Anyway, as far as her waiving her right to a trial by jury, legal strategy, for good or bad. Her attorneys perhaps thought any jury would hate her guts so much that they wouldn't acquit her, so why bother. They rolled the dice and got snake eyes. Or, more likely, if the judge convicted her, she could later say on appeal that her legal counsel sucked as part of her appeal, and get new representation.

    The prosecutors couldn't go for reckless endangerment because she was younger than him and he was 18. At least that's my understanding. As far as people saying she's gonna live an f'd up life over this, never underestimate a narcissist. I don't believe it for a minute. There's a long litany of "similar" cases. Tyler Clementi, that woman who psychologically tortured her neighbor's kid on FB and the kid suicided, etc, ALL overturned. I think the message here is that the behavior is unacceptable, even if it isn't "illegal". She's obviously very disturbed, but then we get into the whole when does mental illness absolve you. Curious to see what happens with the Tysen Benz case. "Malicious use of telecommunication services and using a computer to commit a crime." Nothing will happen to her, except counseling, which is OK. Not so much for Tysen Benz.

    I don't want to make it sound like I'm being wishy-washy and not taking a committed stand. I am a million % behind the First, I just can't hose myself off with enough gasoline to get rid of the skeeves over some of these cases. No worries, she'll walk in the end. Too bad it's not a long walk off a short plank, lol.
     
  17. JetBlue

    JetBlue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2004
    Messages:
    11,622
    Likes Received:
    5,835
    Sure, a defense sometimes needs an irrational verdict, and in those cases all they need is one irrational jury out of twelve to prevent the verdict they are hoping to avoid.

    Point is, you're better off with a jury and simply trying to convince 1 of 12 to not convict than a single judge.
     
  18. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2004
    Messages:
    32,235
    Likes Received:
    30,552
    Care to share a War story there JB? :p
     
  19. jetophile

    jetophile Bruce Coslet's Daughter

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2004
    Messages:
    14,753
    Likes Received:
    8,208
    Time to inject something light. Judges. I got a stupid dummy parking ticket with 2 mins. left on the meter, yet there's that ticket on my windshield in all its mocking magenta glory. Why, why?! I dropped my quarters counting off on my fingers 10 mins. dry cleaner, 10 minutes bank, 5 minutes getting chocolate milk that my mo-in-law loves . . . Rrrrrrrrr! Ticket! Why?! Again, why, why?!!! My math skills are awful, but I totally had it and sprinted getting back and the damn meter had 2 minutes left. TWO MINUTES LEFT. Forget about trigger happy, this was parking ticket slamming happy. Insensate evil. I live for small victories, but there was no sense in arguing it.

    I went to the local town clerk/court to pay the stupid thing (it was only 20 clams), and the judge said, "Good thing you did it in person. If your check got lost in the mail, good reason to put a lien on your house." "What?" "Thank you for taking care of it (winks). The post office is a funny thing, you did well to hand it over." Hand it over? What is this, the 20s in a gin joint? I was dying to say, "Objection. I had two minutes left on the meter." He was totally messing with me, but I paid cash, and got a receipt. I took the high road. "Well, that $20 dollars better be worth something, Your Honor. Gavel, please, court is adjourned." AND HE DID IT. This was 11 a.m. on a goddamn Tuesday. I couldn't figure out if I was enamored or still pissed off. That's a true story. All of my stories are true.
     
  20. Greenday4537

    Greenday4537 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2011
    Messages:
    5,721
    Likes Received:
    3,181
    So what procedure was screwed up that will grant her an appeal? You seem quite convinced there was such an issue so you must be aware of something.

    Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
     

Share This Page