Hindsight - Should Sam have sat out 2018 behind a Vet QB?

To me it all depends on the QB. The looks of it Sam is just suffering from some hard knocks which should help his development as he learns and sees and starts to process quicker. I hope anyway or we will have another Sanchez and Geno.

 

I think it was a good decision to start him to expedite his learning process. Real game experience will help him during off season. He is said to be a quick learner so let’s hope all this adversity will count for something in coming years

 

I'm usually always of the belief that rookies QB's are better served playing versus sitting on the bench. When you're doing the things you practice on the field, it transforms from studying to doing, and that goes a long way. But, throwing a rookie QB into the mix is also highly dependent on the supporting cast and the coach. I went into the season thinking we wouldn't be as bad as we are that we could realistically sniff 7-9, 8-8, but what we're seeing right now is the jets looking like a team that will pick top 5 in the draft. That speaks to 2 things, lack of talent to uplift a rookie QB and it also speaks to a coaching staff that is unable to mask deficiencies, and get the most out of the players on the roster.

Darnold was always going to make mistakes - he's a rookie, but what we don't want to see is what we've been seeing as of late. Deer in the headlights, happy feet, etc. I'm not sure sitting him would be the answer at this point, but something has to happen in order to get him on the right track. People mite make the argument that Bowles shouldn't be fired in-season, I'd argue the longer he stays on the worse this team will fracture. Someone has to get let go

 

You can certainly argue that he should have sat due to the way things have gone down in recent weeks. However, it's falling on coaching at this point. They are not setting him up to succeed.

For example. Burnett had TWO targets yesterday, didn't catch any of them. That is a problem. He should be getting the looks, not Kearse anymore who went 3/9 for 20 measly yards, and an out of bounds catch. Burnett has a (potential) future on this roster. Kearse does not.

It's maddening.

 

Pretty much but I hope he doesn’t die in the hands of clueless Bowles.

 

No.

 

I think it doesn't matter. He's either got the mental makeup and physical tools to get there or he doesn't. If he can't take a little adversity he's not going to be great. If he sees enough NFL D's maybe when he matures it will sink in. Learning isn't linear. I wouldn't discount that he is actually getting something out of playing. If he starts taking a physical beating that's a different story. I don't think he is right now.

 

They should've kept Bridgewater and played him

 

I am praying its this. Look, he didn't have his 2 starting receivers to practice with for weeks. I am actually not sure how both of them came to play yesterday after very limited practicing last week. But with the exception of yesterday, most games he gets sacked 1-2 times, which isn't great but not detrimental. Let him go out there and make mistakes, he will learn from them. If we suck the rest of the year at least we get a top 5 pick and Bowles is history.

 

I agree with all of that. It would've been better for Darnold to sit behind him. I also think the last pick in the 3rd round is not worth Bridgewater the player anyway, a 25 year old potential franchise QB.

 

I agree with Biggs....if a rookie is supposed to be your FQB, then play him and see if he's got the "right stuff". If he doesn't, you need to go shopping again, ASAP. Despite the mistakes, I believe Sam has the "right stuff". I just hope this CS doesn't get him killed or ruin him, so that's why they need to be fired ASAP.

 

I both agree and disagree with this. There's a big if in there that's missing for me. If you think he is ready then sure. If you don't, then you are probably destroying any chance that he will ever be ready. I think Darnold was ready.

 

There is more to learning on the job than just Darnold's growth. Unfortunately the competition learns about him as well. You have to factor it in. They now know that he struggles between the 20s when he cant throw it to the middle of the field and can be baited into mistakes on the sidelines. This is going to follow him his whole career.

Learning from the bench hides weaknesses until you can fix them. That's why it is sometimes better to let QBs learn from the bench if you can. The Jets could've done that, they were well set up to do that actually, but they didn't.

 

I agree with most of this post, but not the bolded. You may be right to some extent with some of those who have "greatness" inside of them, but not all of them. People aren't stamped with a cookie cutter. They are individuals. Gross generalizations about people or things are almost never true. Some people can have great potential, but it gets destroyed by not being put in a position to succeed, and too much adversity can destroy their passion and confidence. Others do have an iron will, and "will" themselves to greatness in spite of everything. Those with iron wills usually have more passionate personalities, but not always.

A little adversity is one thing, but Sam has faced a LOT of adversity this season. Rookie QBs who have a good HC, OC and QB coach and a solid team around them face enough adversity without having to over come their own CS and teammates. Too much adversity too soon can destroy one's confidence and passion for what they are doing.

Sam and McCown have a great relationship. I think that we have to hope that that relationship will help Sam survive this season and keep him from getting too frustrated, discouraged and losing confidence. I don't think it will in his case, but none of us knows enough about what Sam is thinking and feeling.

"Greatness" is one thing. Sam may never have had "greatness" in him, but I think he had the ability to become at least "very good" if not "great." With the amount of adversity that Sam is facing, his ability to become even "very good" could be getting destroyed.

You're right about learning not being linear, and not discounting that he is actually learning from playing right now. When one is overwhelmed by adversity, however, it can be hard to learn anything. One just struggles to keep one's head above water. Hopefully, he is learning, or if he is struggling now just to keep his head above water, once the season is over, he can look back and will learn lessons from what he went through.

 

Of course Sam should have sat at least the first half of this season. He wasn’t ready and it was naïve to think he was. We got a pig in a polk. The kid only had 2 years starting in college and one of those seasons was mediocre. Yet from that he decides to be enter the draft at 20, which is too young for an NFL QB who isn’t a standout prodigy.

When we took him we had a decent plan for developing him while he sat and learned behind a veteran. McCown is old and fragile and probably would have only lasted 8 or so games – which would have been the perfect time to bring in Sam and begin the starter development. Thus he would have (should have) had 8 or 9 weeks to learn the ins and outs while not having the HUGE amount of pressure a starting NFL QB has. In hindsight there is simply no question that should have been done. To be honest, we didn’t even need hindsight because it was the prevailing wisdom in camp.

What changed? Sam turned out to be fairly serviceable…in preseason. Preseason, where you face a bunch of guys who aren’t NFL caliber. He was only frigging 20 years old. The only reason to start him week one would be that he’d shown to be a prodigy. IMO the coaches and fans saw things that weren’t there.

People on this board are still seeing things that aren’t there. Sure the Jets are not that talented, but at this point neither is Sam. Forget the rest of the starters in the league, Sam has shown less upside than any of the other rookie QBs drafted this season.

We have way more talent than Arizona, especially up front. Yet when Rosen goes out there he brings fire and plays like he is ready to score a TD every drive. He’s a fighter who tries to make things happen. That is someone who is ready to learn from adversity. BTW, who does Baker Mayfield have to throw to? How many people need to google that even though we played them? He doesn’t have any stars. But again, he plays with the determination of a guy on verge of winning all the time, even when his back is against the wall. He leads in the face of adversity. Even Josh Allen has won two games with a shit show the Bills offense is – and like the others, even though he is inexperienced, he plays like a hungry leader. These guys leave you with the impression that, if in the last two minutes they have a chance to lead the team to a win, they will. They can rally their teammates. They are ready to learn from adversity.

I don’t see any of that in Sam at all. He seems to lack the fire to lead, is under too much pressure to properly develop, and it’s looking like the offense is losing confidence in him. When you are backed against a wall you have to lead. But maybe Sam is too young, and he doesn’t ever show that fire.

All of this bumps and bruises, learning from adversity to develop an unready QB is a fantasy. That is for guys that were ready to take that step. He is not ready for the position he is in and the longer we leave him out there the more he is going to regress. There is so much pressure being the starter in the NFL that “learning on the fly” rarely happens when a QB isn’t ready. Its time to take him out, let him breathe and learn without all the noise, slow the season down. Let the world, and media, forget about him for a while. The “all star savior” tag is dying and maybe that is the best things that could happen for him now. Go back to square one and start over with him.

You want Sam Darnold to have a chance in this league you pull him back now and start again when he is more prepared, and expectations are much lower. Benching won’t hurt his psyche nearly as much as his offense losing confidence in him – and that seems to be happening right now.

 

Good post. I don't agree with your initial statement, but do pretty much with the rest of your post. I think the wisest course with rookie QBs is to look at each situation on a case-by-case basis, looking at where the rookie is mentally (including knowledge of the playbook, confidence, poise, and leadership) and physically (healthy, sound technique, no glaring fundamental issues, accuracy), and then looking at the team, i.e., the talent around him, and how the team responds to him, and then making a decision on what's best for the QB and for the team.

Of course one can only learn some things by playing one's self, but I don't think it hurts any QB to sit for a season if he has a competent veteran QB to start ahead of him. I think Sam could have learned a lot by sitting this season, watching Teddy or McCown play ahead of him, and asking questions as to why they they made the decisions they did and/or did certain things in situations. Sanchez absolutely should never have started as a rookie. He had one season of collegiate starting experience. He had a dumbass, rookie HC who was predicting SB. With Sanchez, the problem was that the Jets didn't have a competent vet to start ahead of Sanchez, and they didn't have an adult, rational HC. Sanchez may never have amounted to much, but imo any chances he had to become a quality long-term starter in the NFL were ruined. With Sam, the Jets had two very capable QBs who could have started ahead of Sam and they had an adult as a HC, although one who know almost nothing about offense or developing a rookie QB.

Initially, I was deadset against starting him to begin this season, not only because of the OL, but because of the 3 games in 10 days, Bowles being so conservative, and Bates being such a big question mark. Eventually, I came around to starting him, but now I'm starting to think that I was right initially. Once you've started a rookie QB it's hard to bench him if he struggles and starts playing poorly, because you don't know what that will do to his or the team's psyche. The thing is Sam does seem to really be struggling and if he continues to put up performances like he did yesterday, his confidence and psyche could take a real hit from which he may never recover. He's starting to get into bad habits like locking onto receivers and his accuracy is suffering. He's probably pressing, which will only make things worse. The thing is, however, that when athletes press, it can be better to let them play and work through it, as some will just sit and stew if they are benched, and matters can get worse. I don't trust Bowles or Bates to know what is best for Sam or do what is best for Sam. They're probably both more concerned with salvaging their own careers.

The lack of talent around him hurts some, but the major source of the problem is Bowles and Bates. They're not putting him in a position to succeed. With Long struggling with shotgun snaps, it's absolutely stupid to keep calling plays with Sam in shotgun formation. By this point in the season, he should know enough plays with traditional snaps from center and be comfortable taking snaps from under center. I'm really starting to wonder if continuing to start Sam could cause him more psychological damage than benching him. I sure hope that McCown can help Sam get through this, because I really like Sam. He is our hope for the future. If he gets ruined all hope is lost for this franchise.

 

Starring him was the right call. We wouldn’t be any better with mccown or teddy. The franchise is all about Sam now. We just have to get the pieces around him to prop him up until he reaches his potential.