2018 FAs: Even With a Ton of Cap Space, Can the Jets Really Do Much Fix the Roster?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by NCJetsfan, Aug 22, 2017.

  1. FJF

    FJF 2018 MVP Joe Namath Award Winner

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    If you want to fix it through fa you have to outbid the 9ers for cousins. Trade down the top 5 pick if you can and draft the o line. Next year will still be a bit rough as the rookie lineman season but the team will be prime in 2 years
     
  2. Attackett

    Attackett Well-Known Member

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    Draft the QB, spend big on whichever top WR shakes free, spend on an OL or two, then draft to surround drafted QB with offensive talent at OL, WR, RB.

    Most importantly bring in a HC that will know what to do with influx of offensive talent.
     
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  3. TwoHeadedMonster

    TwoHeadedMonster Well-Known Member

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  4. Peebag

    Peebag Well-Known Member

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    we're easily 2-3 years from being competitive. Let's wait and see what next year's draft brings.
     
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  5. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    Can't forget the 1-15 96 Jets jumping to 9-7 in 1997 and 12-4 and afc title game in 1998. So saying 2-3 years away from being competitive could be a stretch. This season could say a lot though. If they do really go 0-16 then your 3 year comment could be correct for sure. I just hope their is more on this current team than people think.
     
  6. Peebag

    Peebag Well-Known Member

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    Yea...I'm not seeing a whole lot of talent on the offensive side the ball...it needs an overhaul - and we really don't have any decent CBs or LBs - those items will not get fixed in one or two off seasons.
     
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  7. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    We won't know for certain what the team's needs will, who will develop and who won't, until the season is over, but I think we have some pretty good hints as to what our needs will be.

    QB - unless Petty or Hack suddenly and/or surprisingly develop, the Jets need a FQB. Regardless of whether Hack or Petty prove to be the guy or the Jets draft a QB early next year and either start him immediately, or start Hack or Petty and let the rookie set for part of the season, it's probably going to be another year or two at a minimum before our QB position is solidified and that QB is comfortable, confident and in charge of the offense. If Bowles is fired and the new HC doesn't retain Morton or the WCO, and switches to another offensive system, it could be even longer, as both Petty and Hack will have to learn that new system. In addition, if the Jets don't fix the OL, get some playmakers and WRs who can actually hold onto the ball, the QB won't have much of a chance of developing. Even if the Jets add some OL and a RB or WR in FA, and then focus solely on offense in the draft (yeah, like that will happen), those players may not pan out or may take some time to develop. 1 QB

    RB - Powell is a good #2 RB, but he isn't a workhorse or starting caliber RB. Forté is done. I don't expect much from him this year at all, even if the OL gets their act together. He has missed practically all of the offseason with balky hamstrings. McGuire looks like a nice addition to the backfield, but he isn't starting quality, either. At best, he's a #2 RB, and may only be a #3. If Firkser makes the team, he has to hold onto the ball, and his blocking and running ability remain to be seen. They are definitely going to need to add at least a starting-caliber RB. 1 RB

    WR - This group had the most potential, and may be the fastest groups of WRs we've ever had, but has been arguably the most disappointing. They struggle getting open, and when they get open they can't hold onto the ball. Enunwa should be back next season, but he has his own problems with drops. I think your #1 WR has to have very reliable hands, and so I don't think Enunwa will ever be a quality #1 WR. We have to find a #1 WR, and if this group can't hold onto the ball, almost all of them will have to be replaced with WRs who have reliable hands. It's unrealistic to think that this can happen in next the next offseason. It will probably take two at a minimum with all of our other needs, and then those new WRs have to learn the offense, develop chemistry with the QB, and if they're rookies, adjust to the speed of the NFL. At least 1 WR (a #1)

    OL - Bowles constant and continued rotation of players in the name of competition is preventing the Jets' OL from developing any sort of chemistry and timing. I believe the truth is however, that even if he had announced the starters in minicamp, they would still be struggling. They just aren't that talented. Carpenter is probably the best of the group, but he's 28 and his contract expires following the 2018 season. Will his level of play stay high, and if so, will the Jets re-sign him? Even if so, they probably could still upgrade his spot. If Beachum can return to his pre-injury form, then he would be the best, but it's more than a little disconcerting that he can't easily beat out Ijalana who is a JAG. Also, he's at best a short-term stop gap. The Jets have to find his replacement in the draft in 2018 and start grooming him. We're probably stuck with Winters at RG for at least another year or two. He's ok and with a better C and RT one either side of him, he could be fine. I think that both Shell and Qvale are at best decent backups. The Jets need to find a quality RT starter. Johnson was ok last season, but can't seem to put Harrison in his rear view mirror. In all likelihood, either or both will need to be replaced, and they're both FAs following this season. In short, the Jets could wind up needing to replace 4/5 of their starting OL. Conservatively, we need at least 2 OTs.

    TE - In what will be a surprise to many, I expect this group to be our strongest this season. I think ASJ will be a star, Leggett will develop into a quality, reliable TE. Vander Laan seems to have a ton of potential. Either Gragg or Tomlinson could contribute as well. 0 TEs

    DL - Nothing needs to be said here. This group is set. The only possible need here is at NT if the Jets don't retain Pennel and McLendon (who becomes a FA following the 2018 season), retires or isn't re-signed. Possibly 1 NT

    ILB - Demario Davis is a stopgap. Will Connor Harris develop into a quality starter? He may not make the team, and if not, might not pass through waivers to make the PS (if the Jets desire to sign him for the PS), or could get signed off of the PS. For that matter, will Lee develop into a quality starter? Lee has the speed and athleticism, but our defensive system probably isn't conducive to bringing out Lee's best. At least 1 ILB, possibly 2.

    OLB -
    Jenkins will be a quality, consistent starter, but won't be a huge factor in pressuring opposing QBs. Do the Jets have another quality starting OLB who can supply consistent pressure on opposing QBs? They may have their best depth ever at the position, but probably don't have a topflight pass rusher, unless one of their guys proves he can get the job done. They need a stud pass rusher. 1 stud pass-rushing OLB

    CB -
    Can Claiborne stay healthy? If so, will he be happy here and want to re-sign? Burris started strong in TC but has tailed off recently. Will he develop into a quality starter? Surprisingly, McDougal is coming on strong in practices and preseason, but can he stay healthy? If so, and he makes the team, he can play in the slot or outside. He could replace Skrine or be the starting #2 CB opposite Claiborne. Will Derrick Jones and Jeremy Clark develop (if Clark can ever get healthy and practice)? Will Darryl Roberts or Marcus Williams (if they make the team) continue to improve and provide quality depth? There are a lot of question marks. I can see where we could very easily need another starting CB next season or by 2019. Possibly 1 CB

    S
    - We should be set at S. O Safeties

    By my conservative estimate, we definitely need 5 players (QB, starting RB, LT, #1 WR, starting ILB). If young players can't/don't step up and prove themselves to be worthy starters this season, we could easily need as many as 5-8 additional players (RT, C, CB, OG, NT, ILB, WR or WRs).

    That's still a LOT of needs. IMO it will take 2 offseasons at a minimum to fill these needs, and that's if Mac (or the new Jets' GM) makes need a priority and doesn't just draft for BAP, their are quality players available at those positions in FA and they're willing to sign with the Jets, there are quality players available at those positions in the draft and the Jets are in position to draft them, and don't have to trade up. If they have to trade up, they'll have less picks to address needs, and it will take longer to fill all those needs. One can't reasonably expect every player one drafts to step onto the field and play like an experienced vet. They're going to take time to develop and will make rookie mistakes. Thus, I think at best it will be 3 years before the Jets will be serious playoff contenders, and that's if everything goes right with player acquisitions and we have a quality HC.
     
    #27 NCJetsfan, Aug 23, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2017
  8. We have to stop equating a team on paper w. Being competitive.A team w a real culture that plays hard & smart combined with quality coaching can vastly outperform the overall talent structure.

    That said you do have to have the talent to put up points in the passing game & right now the jets passing game is incompetent.One would think w vast cap space & a decent number of presumed early round selections that the foundation for a quality passing game can be attained

    The defensive stuff doesn't worry me quite as much.For one bc nobody comes close to dominating on D anymore & w the Jets Front 7 & hopefully dynamic safeties they'll be ahead of the game.Jets have a decent number of young corners w upside & right now LBs are a weak spot league wide.

    I'd say if things are done correctly by the end of the 2018 season the pieces & formula for a new era of winning football should in place to fill in the cracks 2019 offseason.
     
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  9. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Well-Known Member

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    Good analysis. Yeah, being competitive and being Super Bowl contenders are 2 different things. Hopefully the 2018 team will be able to be competitive in every game they play in. Likely not the case for the 2017 team.
     
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  10. westiedog1

    westiedog1 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, the Jets need to draft a franchise QB and make better draft choices down the line but don't discount free agency as way to go from promising to competitive. The Giants pretty much had a tank season with Eli's first year. However, they went out and fortified the OL and WR corps in free agency and the result was a competitive playoff team the following year. If the Jets do get a promising QB in the draft next year, I would hope they would do all they can to get some good talent around him through free agency rather than make the fan base wait until subsequent draft prospects pan out. Jet fans have waited long enough.
     
  11. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    First off, I agree with your post. Free agency is a good supplement for your holes, but it's inherently inefficient because

    1. The FA won't fit into your system as well as someone you drafted.
    2. If a bunch of teams are bidding on him, and you win the bidding, it's probably because you overvalued him. Aka the winner's curse.

    So if you want a winning team, you have to spend your money giving extensions to players you drafted. Here there is no winner's curse because you extend him before he hits free agency. Spending your money this way requires good drafting, accumulating extra picks, and good coaching to develop the picks.

    Also you need a good QB. That goes without explaining. And you use free agency to supplement that QB's WR and OL corps to help develop him, as you said.
     
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  12. JethroTull

    JethroTull 2018 Least Knowledgeable Poster

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    I doubt most of the good ones actually get to free agency.

    Bell, Freeman, Robinson, Landry, and Hopkins are going nowhere
     
  13. Imagesrdecieving

    Imagesrdecieving Well-Known Member

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    OP highlighted OL that are 27 and younger. If our line winds up performing poorly this year that's a position I wouldn't be opposed to adding older stopgap options.

    It is a position that is a positive multiplier for an entire offense and also tends to age pretty gracefully.

    Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk
     
  14. xxedge72x

    xxedge72x 2018 Gang Green QB Guru Award Winner

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    Maybe we can get a new punter.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
     
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  15. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    I don't understand your reasoning for either #1 or #2 above. Why won't FAs fit into your system as well as someone you drafted?

    The FA could be a perfect fit. He could have played in an identical system with another team that drafted before the Jets could have, or because he's a veteran, and doesn't have to adjust to the speed of the NFL, and is supposedly more mature, he could fit just as well as any draft pick. That's not to say that FAs are the most desirable way to build your team, but I totally disagree with your assertion in #1.

    I also disagree with #2. Why is it that because you win the bidding you probably overvalued him. Maybe your team has more cap space and a greater need than the other teams that bid on him.

    This wasn't one of your better posts.
     
  16. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    Sign them allllllllllll. Every single one of em. Hahaha!
     
  17. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    For #1 I didn't mean the FA won't fit into your system as well as a rookie. I meant he won't fit in as well as someone you drafted, developed a couple/few years, and are now re-signing. This of course assuming you haven't changed your system like the Jets do every couple years.

    For #2 it's true that landing a FA doesn't always mean you overvalued him; I used the word "probably" for that reason. But it seems to happen to the Jets a lot.

    Anyway, considering you didn't call me a moron or threaten to put me on ignore, I think you secretly liked my post. :)
     
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  18. MurrellMartin

    MurrellMartin Well-Known Member

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    Cleveland had over $100 million in cap room this offseason and outside of bringing in 2 solid G's, they weren't able to finalize deals with any long-term, impact players. Money matters, but it isn't everything. Yes, there will be some FA's who only care about $ and will go to the highest bidder, but those are the players that worry me the most. Will they cave in and stop caring once they receive their big pay day? The front office and whoever the HC will have to make the best educated guess they can make. There will also be players who want nothing to do with joining an organization that has been poorly run for the past 5, 6 years. There will also be veterans who want to win now and don't want to be apart of a rebuilding project. Etc. Etc. Etc.

    Yes, the $80+ million in cap room is and will be great, but you won't be able to land everyone and you better hope the few you do land continue to be productive players, otherwise you'll be sorry 2 years down the road.

    If it were me, I'd make sure that long-term deals and/or extensions are dolled out to players like Leonard Williams, Quincy Enunwa (get him in Feb or March of '18 on a discount due to the neck injury), Robby Anderson (UDFA's can re-negotiate after 2 years) & James Carpenter before I even go into the FA waters.
     
  19. Peebag

    Peebag Well-Known Member

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    for the life of me, I can't figure out why the Jets (or any team for that matter) cannot find a punter who just punts for a decent average (45yds) - it can't be that hard?
     
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  20. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Good question. With better training methods, and year around focus on the game, one would think that punters' legs would be stronger than in the past, and averages would be better.

    I'm no expert on punting by any stretch of the imagination, I think the reason is probably a combination of factors. One could be that many, if not most, of the STs coordinators are trying to get their punters to kick directionally away from star returners, and put the ball out of bounds inside the 5. It could be a simple matter of when a punter kicks the ball directionally, the ball doesn't go as far down the field. Instead of going 45 yards straight down the field, allowing for the curved trajectory the ball perhaps still actually travels 45 yards, but doesn't go as far down the field, and instead winds up only being a 41 or 42 yard gross kick.

    They also want punters to have big hang times. I would also think that the higher the punter kicks the ball, and the longer it hangs in the air, the less distance it's going to travel down the field, but could be wrong on that.

    For the northern teams that don't play in domes, the punters still have to deal with the elements, wind, rain, snow, cold, and those in the south have to deal more with heat and humidity as well as rain. I don't know whether cold or heat affect the ball and punting/kicking adversely, but I'm sure that one of them must.

    Tom Hackett is an interesting case. He was a two-time winner of the Ray Guy award for best collegiate punter. His last two seasons in college he had gross averages of 46.7 and 47.95. One would think he would have been able to find a job in the NFL, but as of today, he hasn't. I remember Edwards soundly and pretty easily beating Hackett last year in TC and preseason, and Hackett's average wasn't anywhere near his college numbers.

    I don't know what the statistics say historically, so this is just a guess, but could it be that most teams now focus on getting better returners and worked more to improve their blocking on STs?
     

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