[kinghenry89]

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Basically Kerry is campaigning for the democratic gubenatorial candidate in Ohio by accusing the incumbent of rigging the 2004 election against him.

Now I say what I'm about to say as a proud liberal and (slightly less proud) Democrat: Senator Kerry, shut the fuck up. When voters hear him whining like this it's going to jepeordize the 2006 elections for the Democrats because it portrays us as wacko conspiracy theorist. Kerry lost fair and square because he ran an awful campaign and now he has to shut his mouth for the good of the party. If he wanted to complain about the election he should've done in when it happened.

I'll believe to my deathbed that the 2000 election was a sham (black voters were turned away from the polls in Florida.) That did not happen in Ohio. Kerry needs to go away, now.

[Big Poppa Naich]

There was certainly a lot of bull about the election in 2004 in Ohio. I think the evidence is pretty strong that it was stolen. However, you are correct, if he had complaints about it, he should have said it in 04. He is 2 years too late.

[nyscene911]

Originally Posted by Big Poppa Naich

There was certainly a lot of bull about the election in 2004 in Ohio. I think the evidence is pretty strong that it was stolen. However, you are correct, if he had complaints about it, he should have said it in 04. He is 2 years too late.

whats the evidence?

[xjets2002x]

The Democrats can whine about elections being stolen when all those dead people who voted for Kennedy and got him by Nixon get up and start singing showtunes. As for Ohio, that's a load of bunk. Even Salon.com has editorialized as much. If the myth of the stolen election continues onward, eventually we will all be reading it out of history books. The fact of the matter is, 20,000 recounts couldn't produce a Gore victory.

If Kerry wanted to get elected, he should have hidden his lunatic wife from the public eye and come up with a more coherent plan for handling the War in Iraq other than "we'll have tea and crumpets with our allies."

The guy is a stiff. The Democrats had an entirely winnable election on their hand, and they completely muffed it by nominating Lurch, strictly because they are completely in denial over who has the reins in their party, the socialist hippies or the Dick Gephardt types. Bush was grossly unprepared for the first debate and Lurch still didn't take advantage. He was the safe candidate, and he predictably lost.

This time around, the Republicans have no one worth while to nominate. If the Democrats cannot beat the Bob Dole type that will probably be nominated, then they really have no hope.

-X-

[kbgreen]

As for Kerry even Bill clinton told him he was going to loose if he did not lay off the gay marriage thing.

This whining 2 year after the fact is for cowards!

oh, thats right; thats another reason he lost the election.

[Sundayjack]

This is the latest shtick for election losers, as evidenced by the likes of Cynthia McKinney and her recent cries about how electronic voting machines are "destroying our democracy."

It's just much much easier for losing candidates to scream that the process is rigged than it is for them to admit that they are unlikeable people whose ideas are repugnant to a plurality of the voting public.

I've told this story on this board before. Many years back, I spent an afternoon with a buddy and John Kerry drinking in a bar on Charles Street in Boston. He was two guys in one. Half the time, he was "just a guy drinking beers," and the other half, he was this uppity, repulsive, and unlikeable politico. When I saw him during the 2004 campaign, John Kerry was that horrid guy - times FIFTY.

Self-examination would explain the 2004 results to him, if he's interested. They have nothing whatsoever to do with election fraud, vote thieving, or otherwise. Ideas and personalities - neither of which were attractive.

I'll even go one further. I'm pretty certain, although I'd have to look it up, that the ONLY people charged and convicted with voter fraud offenses for the 2004 campaign were Kerry supporters in Wisconsin.

[Sundayjack]

By the way, keep all thus Nutsy Fagan talk going and I'm going to have to go down to the cellar and unleash my pet Hobbes.

[Pam]

Another thing Kerry needs to work on..tell his bitch wife to STFU! She repulses me more than Hillary Clinton does. Theresa Heinz isn't real popular with the women of Pennsylvania.
I always thought this was funny.

[Big Poppa Naich]

X, you actually still think that Gore didn't win in Florida? Come on. You probably also think Gore sued Bush to get a recount, when in fact, Bush was the one who sued Gore.

[nyscene911]

Originally Posted by Big Poppa Naich

X, you actually still think that Gore didn't win in Florida? Come on. You probably also think Gore sued Bush to get a recount, when in fact, Bush was the one who sued Gore.

Naich, thats not the whole story. Heavily democratic districts sued so they could have longer to count, and the Bush camp filed suit to have the counties held to their deadlines. The law said they had until a certain date. That date passed, and at the time(and even after) Bush had more votes.

Bush won the election night vote count in Florida by a little over 1000 votes. Florida state law provided for an automatic recount due to the small margins. There were general concerns about the fairness and accuracy of the voting process, especially since a small change in the vote count could change the result. The final (and disputed) official Florida count gave the victory to Bush by 537 votes, making it the tightest race of the campaign (at least in percentage terms; New Mexico was decided by 363 votes but has a much smaller population, meaning those 363 votes represent a 0.061% difference while the 537 votes in Florida are just 0.009%).

Once the closeness of the election in Florida was clear, both the Bush and Gore campaigns organized themselves for the ensuing legal process. The Bush campaign hired George H. W. Bush's former Secretary of State James Baker to oversee their legal team, and the Gore campaign hired Bill Clinton's former Secretary of State Warren Christopher.

The Gore campaign, as allowed by Florida statute, requested that disputed ballots in four counties be counted by hand. Florida statutes also required that all counties certify and report their returns, including any recounts, by 5 p.m. on November 14. The manual recounts were time consuming, and, when it became clear that some counties would not complete their recounts before the deadline, both Volusia and Palm Beach Counties sued to have their deadlines extended. The Bush campaign, in response to state litigation in the case of Palm Beach Canvassing Board v. Katherine Harris, filed suit in federal court against extending the statutory deadlines for the manual recounts. Besides deadlines, also in dispute were the criteria that each county canvassing board would use in examining the overvotes and/or undervotes. Numerous local court rulings went both ways, some ordering recounts because the vote was so close and others declaring that a selective manual recount in a few heavily-Democratic counties would be unfair. Eventually, the Gore campaign appealed to the Florida Supreme Court which ordered the recounting process to proceed. The Bush campaign subsequently appealed to the Supreme Court of the United States (SCOTUS) which took up the case Bush v. Palm Beach County Canvassing Board on December 1. On December 4, the SCOTUS returned this matter to the Florida Supreme Court for clarification due to their "considerable uncertainty" as to the reasons for certain aspects of the decision. The Florida Supreme Court clarified its ruling on this matter while the United States Supreme Court was deliberating Bush v. Gore.

At 4:00 p.m. EST on December 8, the Florida Supreme Court, by a 4 to 3 vote, ordered a manual recount, under the supervision of the Leon County Circuit Court, of disputed ballots in all Florida counties and the portion of Miami-Dade county in which such a recount was not already complete. That decision was announced on live world-wide television by the Florida Supreme Court's spokesman Craig Waters, the Court's public information officer. The Court further ordered that only undervotes be considered. The results of this tally were to be added to the November 14 tally. This count was in progress on December 9, when the United States Supreme Court 5-4 (Justices Stevens, Souter, Ginsburg and Breyer dissenting) granted Bush's emergency plea for a stay of the Florida Supreme Court recount ruling, stopping the incomplete recount.

Early in the afternoon of December 12, the Republican-dominated Florida House of Representatives voted nearly on party lines to certify the state's electors for Bush. Later that afternoon, the Florida Supreme Court upheld lower court rulings authorizing recounts in several south Florida counties.

About 10 p.m. EST on December 12, the United States Supreme Court handed down its ruling in favor of Bush by a 5�4 vote, effectively ending the legal review of the vote count with Bush in the lead. Seven of the nine justices cited differing vote-counting standards from county to county and the lack of a single judicial officer to oversee the recount, both of which, they ruled, violated the Equal Protection Clause of the United States Constitution.

[Italian Seafood]

In any close election the loser is always going to bitch and say they got jobbed. Doesn't matter what country or party they belong to.

As for Kerry, I say if Tim Dwight is really hurt we should bring him in for a look.

[Royal Tee]

These should have counted!

[typeOnegative13NY]

We should all just let this go and concentrate on what a wonderful job Bush has done since he has been in office. America has never been a better place.

[kinghenry89]

That's what pisses me off so much--every time Kerry cries to the media about how Ohio was stolen from him, more voters wonder do they really want to put this guy's party in control of Congress. He's doing much more damage than he knows.

[jkgrandchamp]