[Matt4776]

Originally Posted by The Uniform Bomber

It's an interesting idea, but maybe too much of a gamble for THIS particular team at this particular time. There are three, main possible outcomes that could unfold from this approach:
1. Both rookie OLBs are productive from the get-go, thus creating a ferocious front 7.
2. Only one of these rookie OLBs is ready to produce early on, while the other develops (or doesn't develop), which, at the very least, would provide one starter and some depth.
3. Both rookie OLBs bust and the Jets still have no pass-rush, and, consequently, other hole(s) get neglected by using two early picks on one position.

I know it worked with Ellis and Abraham, but it also could've just as easily not worked, had both players not developed. With the amount of needs we have, it might be too risky to put those eggs in one basket.

I think weighing the probability of these outcomes should result in the correct decision.

What does this even mean? You could take two offensive players and they too could just as easily bust, leaving us with no offense, and a still-depleted LB corps.

I agree wih Hobbes in the sense that there is no such thing is "absolute" BPA, but we have two positions of need at LB. If we determine that for each pick (1st and 2nd) that a OLB is the current BPA, you take both and run.

[101_GANG_GREEN_101]

Originally Posted by NYJETS4life24

Your a moron according to these other guys for saying that lol we need defense over offense I guess

Lol I find it hilarious. You need offense to win football games, having a top tier defense can only get you so far.

Garrett McIntyre, David Harris, DeMario Davis, and a rookie with the 9th pick (Only Dion Jordan or D. Moore). If none of those two are available you either trade down or you draft Warmack with the 9. From rounds 2-6, you draft offense, offense, offense. We went through stretches where we wouldn't score a freaking TD. It is time to stop neglecting the offense and begin building a modern day NFL offense. You go out and get MM as the OC, yet you don't provide weapons? That's fucking stupid in more ways then one.

It is unbelievable people think we should draft 2 linebackers with our first and 2nd rounders. That my friend is absolutely stupid. We've been drafting defensive players with our first rounders for the past 3 years. When will it stop? When do you stop neglecting the offense? The offense is what will get Rex Ryan fired, if he doesn't do something about it.

That to me is being a moron.

[The Uniform Bomber]

Originally Posted by Matt4776

What does this even mean? You could take two offensive players and they too could just as easily bust, leaving us with no offense, and a still-depleted LB corps.

Right. And I wouldn't double-dip in Rounds 1-2 for two WRs either.

My point is that I think there's an increased risk by selecting two OLBs early on because it isn't just two Offensive players or two Defensive players -- it's the same position (albeit, they have distinguished roles).

With the amount of holes and needs on this team, I'd take less of a risk by targeting the other positions in which we're deficient, along with OLB.

[Harpua]

Originally Posted by NYJETS4life24

I know what are team has, I am as big as a jets fan there is. I know we have plenty of holes to fill on defense but no where near as many as the offense. Do you want to continue putting up 3 points a game and putting the defense in huge holes. The team that scores the most points wins games. It will help the defense out a lot if the offense is better and scores points and can sustain drives so are d isn't on the field the entire damn game. Rex will always but a good defense on the field. I know we need to OLB and safety's. But are offense needs to come first in the rebuilding process.

The reason your being called what you are is you have a very poor view of the current roster. You said it yourself, your a big fan, but obviously cheering loudly does not mean you see reality.

The Jets have two NFL caliber wideouts in Kerley and Holmes, three if one is inclined to count Hill. We also currently have 0 starting caliber OLBs or Safteys on our roster. We also are moving to a new offensive scheme which many hope will help increase the effectiveness of the offense instead of our two yards and a cloud of fumbles from last year.

Sure we need playmakers on offense. At least one more running back is a must. But we need as much help on defense. We have a 34 base front with no OLBs and that is a sad joke. This one draft is not fixing all our holes, by we need to draft the best players we can within our currently defined holes.

[NYJETS4life24]

Originally Posted by 101_GANG_GREEN_101

Lol I find it hilarious. You need offense to win football games, having a top tier defense can only get you so far.

Garrett McIntyre, David Harris, DeMario Davis, and a rookie with the 9th pick (Only Dion Jordan or D. Moore). If none of those two are available you either trade down or you draft Warmack with the 9. From rounds 2-6, you draft offense, offense, offense. We went through stretches where we wouldn't score a freaking TD. It is time to stop neglecting the offense and begin building a modern day NFL offense. You go out and get MM as the OC, yet you don't provide weapons? That's fucking stupid in more ways then one.

It is unbelievable people think we should draft 2 linebackers with our first and 2nd rounders. That my friend is absolutely stupid. We've been drafting defensive players with our first rounders for the past 3 years. When will it stop? When do you stop neglecting the offense? The offense is what will get Rex Ryan fired, if he doesn't do something about it.

That to me is being a moron.

Exactly my point, I do think are recievers are better then perceived. Holmes last year started off pretty well and I thought he would have had a 1000 yard season. Sparano was targeting him in a lot of plays, double digit passes thrown his way per game it seemed like. Hill was open a lot but Sanchez was either getting sacked, didn't see him or over or under threw him. Can't forget him dropping the ball also. Kerley to me is one of the best slot recievers in the league. But I still believe we need to draft a reciever in the top 4 rounds. Holmes is most likely cut after this season. I had high hopes with Cumberland but he did have quite a few drops this past season. The qb position won't be fixed this season unless Marty can fix up one of them.

Would I like two stud OLB's? Yes but I would rather want some offensive talent and playmakers. I would be happy with Warmack at 9, plug him in between brick and mangold and there's three pro bowlers there. Add a fourth with resigning Moore and thats a damn good o line including Howard. Wouldn't mind giving ducasse a shot at guard either. It's going to be a fun draft to watch this year, many holes and we can go many ways plus we didn't trade away any of are picks so we can stay entertained each round.

[NYJETS4life24]

Originally Posted by Harpua

The reason your being called what you are is you have a very poor view of the current roster. You said it yourself, your a big fan, but obviously cheering loudly does not mean you see reality.

The Jets have two NFL caliber wideouts in Kerley and Holmes, three if one is inclined to count Hill. We also currently have 0 starting caliber OLBs or Safteys on our roster. We also are moving to a new offensive scheme which many hope will help increase the effectiveness of the offense instead of our two yards and a cloud of fumbles from last year.

Sure we need playmakers on offense. At least one more running back is a must. But we need as much help on defense. We have a 34 base front with no OLBs and that is a sad joke. This one draft is not fixing all our holes, by we need to draft the best players we can within our currently defined holes.

I'm not just a loud fan, I am on the jets home website, nfl.com, espn, gang green nation, this message board and other sports sites everyday. I am not just a game day fan. I know what are roster is. We have more holes then a whore house, we do need to draft an OLB in the first or second. We do need a safety, but I also wouldn't mind seeing what we have in bush and or Allen. I think Allen can be a good in the box safety and bush in the backfield. We also have a shot at resigning Landry. We will know much more when the draft is here and been through free agency(not that we have much to spend). I'm just sick of seeing are offense not score points, we need to get with the times. I agree with Holmes Kerley and Hill. Kerley is one of my favorite players in the team and to me is one of the best slot recievers in the nfl. We need a TE also, I like powell and he deserves a chance as a full time player and I would like to see McKnight get a shot to get more touches. He is a good reciever out of the backfield. But this draft is deep with quality backs so I think we should take one in the middle rounds.

[Zach]

Originally Posted by The Uniform Bomber

Right. And I wouldn't double-dip in Rounds 1-2 for two WRs either.

My point is that I think there's an increased risk by selecting two OLBs early on because it isn't just two Offensive players or two Defensive players -- it's the same position (albeit, they have distinguished roles).

With the amount of holes and needs on this team, I'd take less of a risk by targeting the other positions in which we're deficient, along with OLB.

It is not 'same' position that is in question. Jets NEED two starting OLBs AND a safety. As of right now, Jets do not have a starter in OLB x2 and Safety x2. Jets must pray they can hold on to Landry at an affordable price - or they can develop either of the picks they spent on S last year. I wouldn't count on the latter.

Of course, this is assuming DeMario can start playing ILB with Harris and be effective.

Offensive side of the ball do lack a play maker, but the hole is not as glaring as it is on the defensive side of the ball. Holmes, even though I am sick of that bitch, is still good enough to start at least. Kerley is coming along just fine, and Hill will be getting better as seasons go along. Unless Jets cut ties with Holmes this year (which I doubt) their WR corps are fine. They need better TE plays and better RB plays - and obviously, better QB plays; out of the three, the only certified 'need' is RB. You won't cut it with Greene in WCO. Keller is a question mark as much as Nacho is a question mark - but they are not the slam-dunk "HELL FUCKING NO" that Greene is. Both guards are FAs - so it would be a prudent call to draft OGs this draft, but I am sure Slauson could come back cheap.

[laxin]

Originally Posted by Zach

It is not 'same' position that is in question. Jets NEED two starting OLBs AND a safety. As of right now, Jets do not have a starter in OLB x2 and Safety x2. Jets must pray they can hold on to Landry at an affordable price - or they can develop either of the picks they spent on S last year. I wouldn't count on the latter.

Of course, this is assuming DeMario can start playing ILB with Harris and be effective.

Offensive side of the ball do lack a play maker, but the hole is not as glaring as it is on the defensive side of the ball. Holmes, even though I am sick of that bitch, is still good enough to start at least. Kerley is coming along just fine, and Hill will be getting better as seasons go along. Unless Jets cut ties with Holmes this year (which I doubt) their WR corps are fine. They need better TE plays and better RB plays - and obviously, better QB plays; out of the three, the only certified 'need' is RB. You won't cut it with Greene in WCO. Keller is a question mark as much as Nacho is a question mark - but they are not the slam-dunk "HELL FUCKING NO" that Greene is. Both guards are FAs - so it would be a prudent call to draft OGs this draft, but I am sure Slauson could come back cheap.

Yes, we do need 2 OLB's, and potentially a safety if Landry walks... But who's to say that even if we do draft 2 OLB's that they both can start? We would honestly be lucky if one could start from day 1. Very rarely do you see OLBs start from day one and make an immediate impact. Aldon Smith as a rookie only played in passing situations. Aside from Von Miller, not many have been able to come into this league and provide an impact. I feel like you keep banging this drum that we need to draft 2 starting OLBs and they are going to immediately fill that need. IMO, its very unlikely that happens.

Since we need 2 starting OLBs that can immediately play, why not look to FA? We dont need to break the bank, but someone like Victor Butler, Antwan Barnes or even Connor Barwin could come at the right price and fill one of those holes. Garret McIntyre isn't great, but he can fill a void if need be.

Also, I think the biggest thing that must be said is that Rex can practically make a top 10 defense with about anyone. If Landry is resigned, which understandably is a big if, this defense isnt in as bad of shape as everybody makes it. Also consider that either Revis is coming back and there's the best defensive player in the game or he's being traded and those picks can help out both sides of the ball.

Like you said, we need a TE and RB... We also need a G and a WR (Hill is a #4 WR right now and Holmes is gone after this year). The biggest need is a franchise QB. Now we might not fill that need this year, but we will by the 2014 draft. That QB would be most benefitted by coming into an offense that has some proven players and not a bunch of rookies. This offense, and team isnt going to improve unless we can actually develop a QB and find some players that actually scare a defense. If done the right way, this draft could potentially fix that. If the focus is on defense, a rookie QB could be walking into a poor situation.... again.


Obviously everything changes after FA so I would like to come back to this discussion then...

[cromartiecove31]

I would love getting one of those first round guys: Ansah, Jones, Jordan, Werner, but the second round guys outside of Okafor and Carradine don't do it for me. If we got a combination of Ansah and Okafor or Jordan and Okafor, I would be very happy, we can't fix this offense without a franchise quarterback, we better hope we don't get the #1 overall pick next year, because if we get #1, you gotta take Clowney

[NYJETS4life24]

Originally Posted by cromartiecove31

I would love getting one of those first round guys: Ansah, Jones, Jordan, Werner, but the second round guys outside of Okafor and Carradine don't do it for me. If we got a combination of Ansah and Okafor or Jordan and Okafor, I would be very happy, we can't fix this offense without a franchise quarterback, we better hope we don't get the #1 overall pick next year, because if we get #1, you gotta take Clowney

That's a great debate right there, who would we take #1 over all next year. But I don't see the jets passing up on one of the top quarterbacks. Can't win without a franchise qb, but clowney is clowney. I don't see us being the worse team in the league anyways so it won't happen

[Zach]

Originally Posted by laxin

Yes, we do need 2 OLB's, and potentially a safety if Landry walks... But who's to say that even if we do draft 2 OLB's that they both can start? We would honestly be lucky if one could start from day 1. Very rarely do you see OLBs start from day one and make an immediate impact. Aldon Smith as a rookie only played in passing situations. Aside from Von Miller, not many have been able to come into this league and provide an impact. I feel like you keep banging this drum that we need to draft 2 starting OLBs and they are going to immediately fill that need. IMO, its very unlikely that happens.

Yes, I am saying Jets would do well to draft 2 OLBs early in the draft (I didn't even say 1 and 2 by the way; it was 1 and *2 or 3*.)

And I have a reason to believe this should be a good way to go - since I do not see this team competing next season. With the amount of holes they have on both sides of the ball, there is no way this team can mount a playoff run, let alone SB run. In short, I am thinking, Jets should use next year to lay the foundation for the future success. So, these OLBs do not have to generate 10+ sacks next season. It is ok. They just have to learn how to play at the position, and get better at them. Next year will be the kind of 'grace period' for them, in other words. (And the newly drafted safety too, if Jets picks him at top 4 rounds.)

On top of that, I see the defense closer to the championship quality than the offense is - if Jets can patch these holes. Once that side is done patching up, Jets should be in prime position to concentrate on offense. If Keller stays, with Kerley and Hill remaining, Jets are not that far off on offense in terms of starters. They would need some OLs, some play making RB and probably a QB that will replace Sanchez (provided he continues to suck with no sign of improvement.)

You can go either way - drafting offense at the top of the draft this year and addressing OLBs next year. Just, I see a lot more value from OLBs at the top of the draft than I see values from offensive players. That was why I thought it would be prudent to tap on the abundant talent from this draft instead of forcing the issue when the talent is not there.

Since we need 2 starting OLBs that can immediately play, why not look to FA? We dont need to break the bank, but someone like Victor Butler, Antwan Barnes or even Connor Barwin could come at the right price and fill one of those holes. Garret McIntyre isn't great, but he can fill a void if need be.

I'd like to see Connor Barwin 1. if he comes dirt cheap or 2. if Jets need one more LB to patch things up. I do not see either happening.

Also, I think the biggest thing that must be said is that Rex can practically make a top 10 defense with about anyone. If Landry is resigned, which understandably is a big if, this defense isnt in as bad of shape as everybody makes it. Also consider that either Revis is coming back and there's the best defensive player in the game or he's being traded and those picks can help out both sides of the ball.

We all know Rex can make chicken salad out of chicken shit when it comes to defense - what I want to see is what he can do when he actually has chicken instead of chicken shit.

Like you said, we need a TE and RB... We also need a G and a WR (Hill is a #4 WR right now and Holmes is gone after this year). The biggest need is a franchise QB. Now we might not fill that need this year, but we will by the 2014 draft. That QB would be most benefitted by coming into an offense that has some proven players and not a bunch of rookies. This offense, and team isnt going to improve unless we can actually develop a QB and find some players that actually scare a defense. If done the right way, this draft could potentially fix that. If the focus is on defense, a rookie QB could be walking into a poor situation.... again.

I have provided my reasoning above for why I would like to see Jets draft LBs in favor of offensive skill players. (If Warmack slides down to 2nd, I'd prefer him over anybody at 2nd round, but hell will freeze over before that happens.)