[1968jetsfan]

Which brings me to a better point, the Jets should be using Tebow as an old style Half-back...Screw the gimmick wildcat, give Sanchez the snaps and Tebow in on about 1/3-1/2 the plays as a half back. Then run the HB Option play about 50% of the time and a drop back play action pass by Sanchez the other half the time. Except instead of running Tebow up the middle like they do on most play actions, have him run just like he was running the option play and drag the defense with him if they buy the play action. heck have McKnight in the backfield with Tebow, run the play action to tebow going right, send Mcknight in to the flat to the left. If the defense bites and chases Tebow put the pass to McKnight in the flat on the left with green field in front of him, or go deep middle if the secondary bites on the Tebow play action.

In my opinion defenses would go mad trying to defend that type of setup.. When a team brings in a wild cat package, defenses know basically what to expect. But if there's no difference in your personel or scrimmage lineup between the two sets defenses should have nightmares. Not to say it's a perfect plan, neither Tebow or Sanchez are great passers..but...ah what the hell, who'd listen to me anyways on this ;)

[FriendlyGiantsFan]

Originally Posted by Br4dw4y5ux

You have to make the comparison. Both QB's were being stomped for mental toughness and bad decision making by the NY media, the fans and a few of their teammates.

Not to make the comparison is just stupid given the situations are so similar.

Eli got lucky though. The Giants didn't let the talent on the team decline to the point that they were un-leadable.

Just wait until Tebow gets in. You guys are going to be saying all the things about him and his chances that the Sanchez supporters are saying now.

There are certainly some valid comparisons that can be made, but you've got to look at the specifics of the situations they came in to. Sanchez came to a team that was 8-3 at one point the season before and traded up from the 16th (IIRC) slot to 5th overall to draft him. The Giants traded up to draft Eli as well, but they were at the 4th overall spot and were coming off a 4-12 season. The point I'm trying to make is that Eli came in to a team with far less talent than Sanchez did.

Eli was criticized for his demeanor/lack of fire, but I don't know if this equates with what Sanchez has going on now. Eli's stoic looks were praised when the Giants won, but were blasted when they lost. I don't think there were ever questions of his work ethic/if the team was pampering him; the questions were about his level of talent. Strahan said he wasn't sure if he wanted to be a part of a rebuilding process at the QB position. Eli's play changed his opinion of that. Eli's top WR (Burress) was a disruptive force in the lockerroom and had a love-hate relationship with the media. Despite all that, however, he and Eli were great friends (Burress even named his son after Eli).

What I'm getting at is that there are significant differences between Mark and Eli.

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by Br4dw4y5ux

You have to make the comparison. Both QB's were being stomped for mental toughness and bad decision making by the NY media, the fans and a few of their teammates.

Not to make the comparison is just stupid given the situations are so similar.

Eli got lucky though. The Giants didn't let the talent on the team decline to the point that they were un-leadable.

Just wait until Tebow gets in. You guys are going to be saying all the things about him and his chances that the Sanchez supporters are saying now.

The comparison can only be made by the fact they both struggled. Where you are dead wrong is the differences are much bigger then the similarities.

The Giants had the No. 4 pick in a draft with 3 top QB's. The Giants actually had a GM and a staff that could make the evaluation. They rated them Eli, Rothlisberger, Rivers. They gave up a ton to move up to get Eli. They went out and drafted talent around him drafting top WRs and unloading their malcontents. They went all in with an excellent offensive coaching staff that put a running O matched with a deep passing O in that matched Eli's talents and the personal.

Compare that to the Jets. They gave away almost nothing to move up in a weak draft to draft a suspect prospect. The GM is a lawyer and accountant who sent the HC who doesn't believe in throwing the ball along with a young very inexperienced OC to work him out and they all came back and said this is our guy. They gave up a late picks for malcontents from other teams, traded into the first round for a TE who is a third round talent.

There is simply no comparison to the approach these two organizations took and despite Eli's struggles there is simple no comparison in the talent coming out of college of these two players.

Sanchez may become a good NFL QB if he is handled right and the right mix is put around him but he simply doesn't have the release, the arm or the accuracy to be mentioned in the same breath as Manning with the exception they both struggled early in the NFL. And the Jets organization has no clue in how to develop a QB which is pretty obvious by their drafts since they got Sanchez and the stunt in this offseason bringing in Tebow.

[CBG]

Originally Posted by Biggs

The comparison can only be made by the fact they both struggled. Where you are dead wrong is the differences are much bigger then the similarities.

The Giants had the No. 4 pick in a draft with 3 top QB's. The Giants actually had a GM and a staff that could make the evaluation. They rated them Eli, Rothlisberger, Rivers. They gave up a ton to move up to get Eli. They went out and drafted talent around him drafting top WRs and unloading their malcontents. They went all in with an excellent offensive coaching staff that put a running O matched with a deep passing O in that matched Eli's talents and the personal.

Compare that to the Jets. They gave away almost nothing to move up in a weak draft to draft a suspect prospect. The GM is a lawyer and accountant who sent the HC who doesn't believe in throwing the ball along with a young very inexperienced OC to work him out and they all came back and said this is our guy. They gave up a late picks for malcontents from other teams, traded into the first round for a TE who is a third round talent.

There is simply no comparison to the approach these two organizations took and despite Eli's struggles there is simple no comparison in the talent coming out of college of these two players.

Sanchez may become a good NFL QB if he is handled right and the right mix is put around him but he simply doesn't have the release, the arm or the accuracy to be mentioned in the same breath as Manning with the exception they both struggled early in the NFL. And the Jets organization has no clue in how to develop a QB which is pretty obvious by their drafts since they got Sanchez and the stunt in this offseason bringing in Tebow.

This is a very very good post,,,,nice job

[raortega3]

Originally Posted by FriendlyGiantsFan

There are certainly some valid comparisons that can be made, but you've got to look at the specifics of the situations they came in to. Sanchez came to a team that was 8-3 at one point the season before and traded up from the 16th (IIRC) slot to 5th overall to draft him. The Giants traded up to draft Eli as well, but they were at the 4th overall spot and were coming off a 4-12 season. The point I'm trying to make is that Eli came in to a team with far less talent than Sanchez did.

Eli was criticized for his demeanor/lack of fire, but I don't know if this equates with what Sanchez has going on now. Eli's stoic looks were praised when the Giants won, but were blasted when they lost. I don't think there were ever questions of his work ethic/if the team was pampering him; the questions were about his level of talent. Strahan said he wasn't sure if he wanted to be a part of a rebuilding process at the QB position. Eli's play changed his opinion of that. Eli's top WR (Burress) was a disruptive force in the lockerroom and had a love-hate relationship with the media. Despite all that, however, he and Eli were great friends (Burress even named his son after Eli).

What I'm getting at is that there are significant differences between Mark and Eli.

Umm... The season prior the Jets had a QB named Favre who the following year had a career year. It isn't like they were a well structured team waiting to be lead to the promise land. They even collapsed late into the season.

[FriendlyGiantsFan]

Originally Posted by raortega3

Umm... The season prior the Jets had a QB named Favre who the following year had a career year. It isn't like they were a well structured team waiting to be lead to the promise land. They even collapsed late into the season.

I think the fact that they were 8-3 and considered (albeit briefly) to be the best team in the AFC BEFORE Favre got hurt says that this was a talented team simply looking for a QB. That isn't the case now, but I think you could make the argument then.

[Jrsy2FLA]

Was just watching First on the Field on NFL network. LT was on there and he said he's been in contact with some Jets players. They're expressing a loss in faith with Sanchez. LT didn't say who told him but they never give up sources. There's always some strife in any locker room but how big is this going to get before the media starts quoting the names of these mysterious sources?

[JetsNation06]

Originally Posted by Jrsy2FLA

Was just watching First on the Field on NFL network. LT was on there and he said he's been in contact with some Jets players. They're expressing a loss in faith with Sanchez. LT didn't say who told him but they never give up sources. There's always some strife in any locker room but how big is this going to get before the media starts quoting the names of these mysterious sources?

True, it's just a matter of time before names are quoted. It's still perplexing that as bad as Sanchez has played this year and last year that he still gets a complete pass by much of the media and much of the Jets clueless fan base. The media needs to start showing all of the horrible stats from Sanchez this year. This will let the wider public know how shitty of a QB he is. He's hurting this team so bad along with many others. Bottom line is this is a WIN business. If you're not winning games then you should not be the starting QB.

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by JetsNation06

True, it's just a matter of time before names are quoted. It's still perplexing that as bad as Sanchez has played this year and last year that he still gets a complete pass by much of the media and much of the Jets clueless fan base. The media needs to start showing all of the horrible stats from Sanchez this year. This will let the wider public know how shitty of a QB he is. He's hurting this team so bad along with many others. Bottom line is this is a WIN business. If you're not winning games then you should not be the starting QB.

It doesn't make the fanbase clueless to understand that Sanchez may be performing terribly and still be the best chance this team has for success.

Many of us went through the Matt Robinson foolishly getting the nod over Dick Todd before injurying himself in the locker room and becoming the nobody he was predicted to be while Todd lead the Jets to one of the best post seasons this awful organizations ever had.

[JetsNation06]

Originally Posted by Biggs

It doesn't make the fanbase clueless to understand that Sanchez may be performing terribly and still be the best chance this team has for success.
Many of us went through the Matt Robinson foolishly getting the nod over Dick Todd before injurying himself in the locker room and becoming the nobody he was predicted to be while Todd lead the Jets to one of the best post seasons this awful organizations ever had.

I don't agree that Sanchez gives us the best chance for success. We are having very little success with him as the starting QB and a good portion of that is due to his poor play. So to say he gives us the best chance at success contradicts his play on the field.

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by JetsNation06

I don't agree that Sanchez gives us the best chance for success. We are having very little success with him as the starting QB and a good portion of that is due to his poor play. So to say he gives us the best chance at success contradicts his play on the field.

Which team that the Jets have the better personal did the Jets lose to? The only team we played with comparable personal the Bills, Sanchez played great.

There is a reason the NFL has loads of teams in the playoff hunt at the end. The league is made up of mostly mediocre teams. The Jets are a mediocre team that has faced a difficult schedule the last few weeks. Lossing to the 49ers and Texans is nothing to be ashamed of or lossing to a mediocre Pittsburgh team on the road.

There are very few Jets fans that support Sanchez who think Sanchez is a great QB. There are very few Jets fans who think Tebow actually gives us a better chance to win then Sanchez does. There are a ton of Tebow fans that really don't give a shit if the Jets win or not.

Sanchez is what he is but that doesn't mean he doesn't give us the best shot based on the personal of this team.

[LongTimeJetsFan]

Originally Posted by Biggs

Which team that the Jets have the better personal did the Jets lose to? The only team we played with comparable personal the Bills, Sanchez played great.

There is a reason the NFL has loads of teams in the playoff hunt at the end. The league is made up of mostly mediocre teams. The Jets are a mediocre team that has faced a difficult schedule the last few weeks. Lossing to the 49ers and Texans is nothing to be ashamed of or lossing to a mediocre Pittsburgh team on the road.

There are very few Jets fans that support Sanchez who think Sanchez is a great QB. There are very few Jets fans who think Tebow actually gives us a better chance to win then Sanchez does. There are a ton of Tebow fans that really don't give a shit if the Jets win or not.

Sanchez is what he is but that doesn't mean he doesn't give us the best shot based on the personal of this team.

But have you SEEN Tebow play QB in a regular season game for the Jets? If not, how could you POSSIBLY know that he's even less accurate than Sanchez and throws the ball like a javelin? Don't you know that putting on a Jets jersey and playing for this great organization multiplies the skillset of players? /stupid

[jets4lyfah]

i wouldn't mind if they got sanchez a brand new team

[Clown]

Originally Posted by Biggs

Which team that the Jets have the better personal did the Jets lose to? The only team we played with comparable personal the Bills, Sanchez played great.

There is a reason the NFL has loads of teams in the playoff hunt at the end. The league is made up of mostly mediocre teams. The Jets are a mediocre team that has faced a difficult schedule the last few weeks. Lossing to the 49ers and Texans is nothing to be ashamed of or lossing to a mediocre Pittsburgh team on the road.

There are very few Jets fans that support Sanchez who think Sanchez is a great QB. There are very few Jets fans who think Tebow actually gives us a better chance to win then Sanchez does. There are a ton of Tebow fans that really don't give a shit if the Jets win or not.

Sanchez is what he is but that doesn't mean he doesn't give us the best shot based on the personal of this team.

^ This! When will people start watching full games INSTEAD of reading articles online about the game or going to nfl.com or listening to fans of other teams / tebow fans????

Any jets fan that watches a full fucking jets game should understand that you have to take these QB stats with a grain of salt. Yes they look bad on paper but if you watch a FULL FUCKING GAME, (Not highlights from ESPN) you will see why people with brains are sticking with Sanchez.

* Degraded offensive talent this season
* Subpar Oline play
* Bringing in polarizing players
* Polarizing media market
* Injuries
* Playing powerhouse teams early in the season

I can't believe some of you guys on here getting broken down by fans of lesser quality and who hold lesser knowledge of the team than you..... You will let them say that your QB sucks because he cant throw to wrs signed off the street running routes against real nfl defenses.

Then we have some more idiots stating that if it was fucking Tom Brady, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning those wr would be probowlers.... um yeah take off the damn dunce cap starting NOW!

Tom Brady always had deon branch or wes welker and when his wr crew went to shit.... guess what? He started throwing to tightends with talent! (But that did not happen over night, he had a few bad games before he got into that groove)

Peyton manning had marvin harrison and reggie wayne, dallas clark and a strong o-line almost his entire time with the colts..... He is currently with the broncos still ironing out chemistry with his new TALENTED group of wrs....(2-3 record)

Eli Manning had a great rushing attack and a stable wr core that consisted of plax and toomer and then transitioned to cruz and nicks. But us foolish fans fail to realize that during the transition.... the GIANTS HAD HORRIBLE QB PLAY. When plaxico shot himself and toomer left, there was no one to throw too... and it took almost a season to groom a new WR core.

Aaron Rodgers.... its like this guy is surrounded by great receivers right? True.. but even he is not invincible. Lose a go to guy like Greg jennings and we start to see the struggling which he is experiencing now... (2-3 record... third in division)


BUT OUR FAIRWEATHER FANS AND MEDIA MARKET wants to make it seem like its all Sanchez's fault.

All of you who have lost faith need a grow a pair, this is the closest you guys have been to a ring in years and you just want to throw it away because everyone else wants you to.

But back to my theme, watch a FULL FUCKING GAME! And if you have time WATCH MORE FULL FUCKING GAMES of OTHER TEAMS TOO! You will see some thing like "hmm... this guy isnt as legendary as I though, he just threw a pick six in the redzone and I though only Sanchize did that..."

You will see some promising things from your beloved jets team as well (like wr and qb chemistry developing with the new core)... its not all that bad....


I am sorry that you had to hear this message coming from a clown but sometimes it has to happen this way.

[Br4dw4y5ux]

It's easier for everybody if this is all Sanchez fault. It takes fewer connections to come up with that result and be satisfied with it.

Until somebody else comes in.

Then it's going to be all about "The Jets SUCK! I can't believe I'm rooting for such a sad sack pathetic organization. Definitely not going out to the stadium to watch this crap!"

[displacedfan]

Originally Posted by JetsNation06

True, it's just a matter of time before names are quoted. It's still perplexing that as bad as Sanchez has played this year and last year that he still gets a complete pass by much of the media and much of the Jets clueless fan base. The media needs to start showing all of the horrible stats from Sanchez this year. This will let the wider public know how shitty of a QB he is. He's hurting this team so bad along with many others. Bottom line is this is a WIN business. If you're not winning games then you should not be the starting QB.

Yeah find me an article giving Sanchez complete pass. Find me a poster giving Sanchez a complete pass. Do you know what complete pass means? That means someone thinks Sanchez gets NO blame. I think everyone on here has assigned Sanchez some blame, its just levels of blame you give him. Some fans think he gets 100% of the blame which is dumb and stupid.

Originally Posted by Biggs

Which team that the Jets have the better personal did the Jets lose to? The only team we played with comparable personal the Bills, Sanchez played great.

There is a reason the NFL has loads of teams in the playoff hunt at the end. The league is made up of mostly mediocre teams. The Jets are a mediocre team that has faced a difficult schedule the last few weeks. Lossing to the 49ers and Texans is nothing to be ashamed of or lossing to a mediocre Pittsburgh team on the road.

There are very few Jets fans that support Sanchez who think Sanchez is a great QB. There are very few Jets fans who think Tebow actually gives us a better chance to win then Sanchez does. There are a ton of Tebow fans that really don't give a shit if the Jets win or not.

Sanchez is what he is but that doesn't mean he doesn't give us the best shot based on the personal of this team.

Good post.

Originally Posted by Br4dw4y5ux

It's easier for everybody if this is all Sanchez fault. It takes fewer connections to come up with that result and be satisfied with it.

Until somebody else comes in.

Then it's going to be all about "The Jets SUCK! I can't believe I'm rooting for such a sad sack pathetic organization. Definitely not going out to the stadium to watch this crap!"

This. Except if Tebow starts, then people will go out. One of the reason Woody probably pushed for Tebow in my opinion. Except if Tebow starts and they lose, people won't go out. Woody doesn't seem to realize that the best way to get fans, is to consistently win

[Clown]

[QUOTE=displacedfan;2610873]Yeah find me an article giving Sanchez complete pass. Find me a poster giving Sanchez a complete pass. Do you know what complete pass means? That means someone thinks Sanchez gets NO blame. I think everyone on here has assigned Sanchez some blame, its just levels of blame you give him. Some fans think he gets 100% of the blame which is dumb and stupid.


/QUOTE]


I agree on this 100%, nice to see we have level headed guys still on this board.

[Br4dw4y5ux]

Originally Posted by displacedfan

This. Except if Tebow starts, then people will go out. One of the reason Woody probably pushed for Tebow in my opinion. Except if Tebow starts and they lose, people won't go out. Woody doesn't seem to realize that the best way to get fans, is to consistently win

The best way for the Jets to use Tim Tebow right now is as the leg placed strategically out from behind the fan while the rest remains tantalizingly hidden by the dancer's quick movements.

Flash him in and out of the game so the fans know he's there. Run some fake punts on 4th and short.

Whatever they do they can't ruin the illusion that he might be a factor at some point. If they do that then he's really not going to be of any marketing value at all.

Woody Johnson hasn't clued in yet to the price of being the guy who ruined Tim Tebow. Especially in the circles he runs in.

[dreamsfloatjoe]

Originally Posted by Biggs

... There are a ton of Tebow fans that really don't give a shit if the Jets win or not.

You maybe right Biggs, I dunno. Suspect, if, Tebow is the starting quarterback these fans will give a (chomp chomp chomp)

To me, thoughts like these are in congruent, I do not know that I have read or heard any Tebow fan say they root for the JETS to loose? Doesn't pass the common sense test to me. Again, you may be right though.

[championjets69]

Originally Posted by Clown

^ This! When will people start watching full games INSTEAD of reading articles online about the game or going to nfl.com or listening to fans of other teams / tebow fans????

Any jets fan that watches a full fucking jets game should understand that you have to take these QB stats with a grain of salt. Yes they look bad on paper but if you watch a FULL FUCKING GAME, (Not highlights from ESPN) you will see why people with brains are sticking with Sanchez.

* Degraded offensive talent this season
* Subpar Oline play
* Bringing in polarizing players
* Polarizing media market
* Injuries
* Playing powerhouse teams early in the season

I can't believe some of you guys on here getting broken down by fans of lesser quality and who hold lesser knowledge of the team than you..... You will let them say that your QB sucks because he cant throw to wrs signed off the street running routes against real nfl defenses.

Then we have some more idiots stating that if it was fucking Tom Brady, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers or Peyton Manning those wr would be probowlers.... um yeah take off the damn dunce cap starting NOW!

Tom Brady always had deon branch or wes welker and when his wr crew went to shit.... guess what? He started throwing to tightends with talent! (But that did not happen over night, he had a few bad games before he got into that groove)

Peyton manning had marvin harrison and reggie wayne, dallas clark and a strong o-line almost his entire time with the colts..... He is currently with the broncos still ironing out chemistry with his new TALENTED group of wrs....(2-3 record)

Eli Manning had a great rushing attack and a stable wr core that consisted of plax and toomer and then transitioned to cruz and nicks. But us foolish fans fail to realize that during the transition.... the GIANTS HAD HORRIBLE QB PLAY. When plaxico shot himself and toomer left, there was no one to throw too... and it took almost a season to groom a new WR core.

Aaron Rodgers.... its like this guy is surrounded by great receivers right? True.. but even he is not invincible. Lose a go to guy like Greg jennings and we start to see the struggling which he is experiencing now... (2-3 record... third in division)


BUT OUR FAIRWEATHER FANS AND MEDIA MARKET wants to make it seem like its all Sanchez's fault.

All of you who have lost faith need a grow a pair, this is the closest you guys have been to a ring in years and you just want to throw it away because everyone else wants you to.

But back to my theme, watch a FULL FUCKING GAME! And if you have time WATCH MORE FULL FUCKING GAMES of OTHER TEAMS TOO! You will see some thing like "hmm... this guy isnt as legendary as I though, he just threw a pick six in the redzone and I though only Sanchize did that..."

You will see some promising things from your beloved jets team as well (like wr and qb chemistry developing with the new core)... its not all that bad....


I am sorry that you had to hear this message coming from a clown but sometimes it has to happen this way.

I take exception to your line playing powerhouse teams. I guess U never heard the old adage coined I think by BP to be the BEST U have to BEAT the best!