[Biggs]

Originally Posted by keypusher

So, judging him against his era, he was average in completion percentage. Point granted.

Going back to your comp list:

Bradshaw is in the HOF for the same reason as Namath: the Super Bowl. Of course, he had four, not one.

Blanda is in because of placekicking, longevity, his amazing 1970 season, and for being the best QB in the early years of the AFL. He's not in because of his passing between 1965 and 1975. (He was 38 in 1965 by the way.)

Unitas was 32 in 1965. He's in the hall for his entire career, the best part of which came before 1965.

Fouts: ?? You want to look at QBs who played during Namath's career, so you pick Fouts, who was a rookie in 1973, by which time Namath was pretty much done? And then you look at the first four years? Why not HOFers whose career actually corresponded with Namath's? Like Len Dawson? Bob Griese? Fran Tarkenton? Because you know what you'll find, and it won't be flattering to Namath.

Namath is in the HOF because of Super Bowl III and because of his off-the-field impact, which can hardly be overstated. Don't try to make a statistical case for him as a Hall of Famer. It can't be done.

Namath is in the HOF because he was a dynamic deep ball passer. With his crappy completion percentage he still ranks extremely high on the all time ypa during his Jets career. He was moving the team down the field with a 50% completion percentage that QB's today who routinely throw in the mid 60's are moving their teams down the field.

Namath played in an era where OL men couldn't extend their arms, the hash marks were out further, meaning you were pinned to the sideline and CB had free shots to the head on WR and QB's.

He threw the ball down the field under much more difficult circumstances.

Give the guy today's TE and slot recievers, the center of the field on every play and favorable rules for the passing game and he would dominate.

Bradshaw is in the HOF because he was absolutely spectacular in post season games who hit bombs for TD's in critical situations to win championships. He was a spectacular player in big spots and a great deep ball passer. The Steelers were great teams but they beat great teams to win SB. He was great, beat great teams and is absolutely deserving of being in the HOF.

[Cakes]

Biggs, RE: ypa
It is arguably the best stat in which to rate QBs.

Namath had a higher ypa than the following Hall of Famers-
Marino, Waterfield, Griese, Baugh, Tarkenton, Layne, Moon, Bradshaw, Elway

[keypusher]

Originally Posted by Biggs

Namath is in the HOF because he was a dynamic deep ball passer. With his crappy completion percentage he still ranks extremely high on the all time ypa during his Jets career. He was moving the team down the field with a 50% completion percentage that QB's today who routinely throw in the mid 60's are moving their teams down the field.

OK, go to football reference and look at Y/C and Y/A for the Jets in Namath's era. Y/C, good but never the best in the AFL. Y/A, not as good as Y/C obviously because Namath was throwing a lot of incompletions. Everybody (by modern standards) threw the ball down the field in the late 60s/early 70s. Not just Namath.

Namath played in an era where OL men couldn't extend their arms, the hash marks were out further, meaning you were pinned to the sideline and CB had free shots to the head on WR and QB's.

He threw the ball down the field under much more difficult circumstances.

So compare him with Dawson, Griese, Tarkenton etc., who played under the same conditions, and draw your own conclusions.

[ajax]

Originally Posted by keypusher

OK, go to football reference and look at Y/C and Y/A for the Jets in Namath's era. Y/C, good but never the best in the AFL. Y/A, not as good as Y/C obviously because Namath was throwing a lot of incompletions. Everybody (by modern standards) threw the ball down the field in the late 60s/early 70s. Not just Namath.



So compare him with Dawson, Griese, Tarkenton etc., who played under the same conditions, and draw your own conclusions.

Draw your own conclusions ... but then you get pissy when people have a different opinion than yours? What you mean to say is draw your own conclusions as long as we agree with you.

[Footballgod214]

The West Coast Offense alone added 15% to passer's completions. The WCO took over about half the running game. Why run for 3 yards when you can pass for 3 yards?

Back in the day, if you ain't slinging the ball 50 yards, you ain't passing.

Imagine if today's QB's could ONLY throw the ball for 20-30-40 yards or more. No dink and dunk. No slot receiver. No TE with hands. Just two ballers on the outside running for their lives. That's what Namath played in.

[The Dark Knight]

I always thought Jets fans were morons, but to say Namath could not make it in today's NFL takes the cake. He would not only make it, he would dominate it. It's today's QB's who could not make it in his era. Think of all the injuries he could avoid with the current NFL rules. Come on! He is not overrated either. He is remembered for who he was. No one ever says he was the best ever. Plus, he came into the league with 2 bad knees and beasted out.

[hornblower]

I saw almost every game Namath played. He was a great leader. A relative was in the huddle with him and he said that Joe called most of the plays at the line.
Additionally, you were allowed to play defense in those days. You could bump receivers all the way down the field and the QB was not protected at all. Head slaps were permitted and the offensive linemen took a real beating. The rules changes have really changed the league and many were necessary but comparing QB's is impossible.

[Acad23]

Good work by all who bothered to respond to the silly notion that Namath is "over-rated". There's a reason he's still the face of the franchise 45 years after SBIII.

He's one of the few bright spots in Jets history as a franchise, and there's "fans" here that feel the need to disparage that?

I'd understand if some fans of another team want to argue about Namath's legitimacy, but it's confounding when a fan of the Jets doesn't lionize the man.

Whether they liked him off the field, NFL players & coaches of the time never doubted his ability on the field...but there's a few Jets fans that do?

Eliminate Namath from Jets history and all we'd have is 53 years of misery.

[CJLang]

Originally Posted by hornblower

I saw almost every game Namath played. He was a great leader. A relative was in the huddle with him and he said that Joe called most of the plays at the line.
Additionally, you were allowed to play defense in those days. You could bump receivers all the way down the field and the QB was not protected at all. Head slaps were permitted and the offensive linemen took a real beating. The rules changes have really changed the league and many were necessary but comparing QB's is impossible.

Of course he called his own plays! Am I the only person old enough to remember when QBs called their own plays?

Tom Landry started to change that in the late 60's when he was having the plays brought in. He even played half a season with Staubach and Morton come in on alternate plays.

It wasn't until the late 70's that most QBs stopped calling their own plays. I think Jim Kelly was one of the last to actually do it.

QBs now have more freedom to make calls, but the OC sends in a package and a play. Guys like Manning and Brady then have the option to run any play that can be run in that package based on the D. Not exactly calling their own plays, but enough freedom to change it up when they want.

[The Dark Knight]

Pretty sure Peyton Manning does his own thing too. haha.

[Angelsword]

He was basically terrible, makes me think of Rex Grossman, one of the worst Qbs to ever get to the Superbowl.

Oh and Namath has his own youtube channel which basically nobody watches.

[CJLang]

Originally Posted by The Dark Knight

Pretty sure Peyton Manning does his own thing too. haha.

He still has a package and play sent in. He has the option to change the play at the line. But he doesn't come into the huddle and say this is what we're running.

Which is what I already wrote. haha

[Biggs]

Originally Posted by keypusher

OK, go to football reference and look at Y/C and Y/A for the Jets in Namath's era. Y/C, good but never the best in the AFL. Y/A, not as good as Y/C obviously because Namath was throwing a lot of incompletions. Everybody (by modern standards) threw the ball down the field in the late 60s/early 70s. Not just Namath.



So compare him with Dawson, Griese, Tarkenton etc., who played under the same conditions, and draw your own conclusions.

Since I saw Dawson, Griese, Tarkenton, etc. I certainly can draw my own conclusions. None of those 3 were in the same class as Namath. I saw Tarkenton play in Yankee Stadium on several occassions, he was fun to watch but he was a different kind of circus then Namath. Griese and Dawson were both great tacticians, not even on the same planet as Namath throwing the ball.

The best of the bunch on the tactical level much like Griese and Dawson was Starr who was a great QB.

The guys who threw the ball down the field like Namath, Bradshaw and Jurgensen both great throwers, Bradshaw was surrounded by great talent but Bradshaw could throw with anyone.

Lots of great QB's over the years. Namath mechanically was as good a pure passer as anyone in league history. Looking at his statistics is a one deminsional view into the player who was tough as nails, played in pain every day and when he had the goods around him grabed the brass ring. That's all anyone can ask of a player who the league and team used and made a fortune on. Namath belongs in the HOF because he was great and everyone who saw him play knows it.

[Acad23]

Originally Posted by Angelsword

He was basically terrible, makes me think of Rex Grossman, one of the worst Qbs to ever get to the Superbowl.

Oh and Namath has his own youtube channel which basically nobody watches.

What wonderful insight...and a great addition to this forum.

Welcome.

[cdz12250]

You might as well say Mickey Mantle was overrated.

[mr nyjet]

Originally Posted by Jett

i cant believe what im reading. this guy would THRIVE in todays era. Receivers are faster, rules would be in favor, his arm was amazing, despite his percentage (which was pretty good at his time, few were throwing around 50 something percent) he had an accurate arm. This guy was the first to throw for 4000 yards in a NON throwing era.


Please, this guy would be a beast. Most qbs back then would thrive now.

if joe willie was on the pats today, brady would be the backup qb......

[mr nyjet]

Originally Posted by al_toon_88

So if mark Sanchez had played in Namath's era, what would his completion % have been, 35%?

he wouldn't make an afl roster...maybe a backup in the cfl.

[joe]

Originally Posted by MURDR

He's overrated because of his guarantee. GOOD QB when you consider his era, NOT HoF-worthy.

"Best pure passer" - Vince Lombardi, HOF Coach, Green Bay Packers, Washington Redskins

"The guy who in a single game scared me most, Namath. Him and then Bradshaw" - John Madden, HOF Coach, Oakland Raiders

"Some guys can throw long...Namath can pass long" - Wilber Charles Ewbank, HOF Coach, Baltimore Colts, New York Jets

"Greatest athlete I ever coached" - Paul 'Bear' Bryant, HOF Coach, Univ. of Alabama

There is a film clip of Namath in the opening game of the NYJ Super Bowl season against the Chiefs in KC (20-19 Jet win) in which he effortlessly dropped back and 'flicked' a perfect bomb in stride to Maynard. Even with his creaky knees, his dropback footwork was a 'blur', the release, the predessessor to Dan Marino. A stunning "no-knees" talent who once had wheels few QB's could even dream about. Later, in the NFL, often a sitting duck who nevertheless hung tough--Namath was a football player of the first order and deserving of his place in the HOF.

You obviously never saw him. I cite this quote below MURDR as it pretty much sums up your keen, clueless experienced eye:

"If he's worth $400,000, then I'm worth a million." - Dr. Bill Ryan, Cleveland Browns (fine, game-manager qb..who at the end of the day couldn't carry Namath's jock)

[FriendlyGiantsFan]

Originally Posted by Cakes

His talent was off the charts, FGF. His talent was arguably top 5 all-time.

The knock on Namath was performance. Outside of 1972 when he was a consensus 1st-team all-pro, he was spotty in the 1970s.

I'm not knocking his ability to throw the ball, but he struggled with zone coverage later in his career. I know that his career was limited by injuries, but you can make the argument that lots of players would have great careers if not for injuries.

Arm-wise he was amazing, but the execution wasn't always there.

[FriendlyGiantsFan]

Originally Posted by Acad23

He's in the Hall.


Bill Walsh said Namath was "the most beautiful, accurate, stylish passer with the quickest release I've ever seen."

You've heard of Bill Walsh, right?

Bill Walsh also said Phil Simms had the best arm he'd ever seen. I'm a Giant's fan and even I know that's crazy.

I get that I'm not a Jet fan, but that doesn't mean I can't say anything negative about the Jets.