Thrown To The Wolves...

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by NYJetsO12, Sep 5, 2018.

  1. Axel574

    Axel574 Active Member

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    Good Grief. It was a joke. Lighten up Francis.
     
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  2. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    Building the team "piecemeal" is a direct result of his BPA mentality. That philosophy would be great if players could play any position you wanted them to. You could just load up on the very best athletes, assign them positions and be done! But the reality is that your needs often don't line up with the BPA, so you have to make a choice. If the BPA sitting there when you're on the clock is a surefire All Pro in waiting, and you already have a decent guy at his spot, well maybe you take the BPA anyway because there's a good chance he upgrades you significantly, BUT you have to factor in the cost of this pick preventing you from addressing a high priority need. IMO you're better off leaning towards filling your highest need over pure BPA, so that you look at need first, and then see which BPA in that position is available. If you don't do this, you wind up having perpetual holes, which is what the Jets have now. Fortunately, Macc deviated from his pure BPA approach to address the team's biggest hole, QB. SO we know he can do it, now let's see him address pass rusher and OL before he takes the next BPA Safety or CB.
     
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  3. NYJetsO12

    NYJetsO12 Well-Known Member

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    Well ok ..to me is just all good bout him
     
  4. Axel574

    Axel574 Active Member

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    I see that... I promise you I'm a big Namath fan myself. I was just cracking wise. We're good.
     
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  5. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Bravo! Well said. This is where we need a clapping hands emoticon.
     
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  6. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Semantics and degree of difference are very important here.

    I tend to agree with you, but depending upon specifics I could disagree. In a post yesterday you said something like, "if the Jets have a position that is already stacked and the BPA sitting there at the Jets pick plays that position, that you think the Jets should take a player at a position of need even if he is rated 10-15 spots below that player." IMO that all depends upon what the difference is in rankings. For argument's sake, let's agree to use the NFL rating system where the top score a prospect can get is a 10. For comparative purposes, let's use Leonard Williams as an example. In his NFL.com draft profile he is rated a 7.53. Following are three distinct scenarios.

    1) Let's say the overall BPA in the draft at your pick is rated a 7.53, and the players you have at that position are rated around a 6.25. You have a big need at another position where your best player is rated a 5.78, but the best player available in the draft at that position is only ranked a 6.46. Which would you take?

    2) Using the same metrics, what if the BPA at the position of need is rated a 7.15? Which would you take?

    3) Finally, what if the metrics were shifted such that the overall BPA's rating is significantly higher than the BPA of the position of need (7.85 to 6.35), BUT the difference in improvement at the two respective positions was significantly higher or the position of need (7.5 to 7.85 for the position of the overall BPA, and 5.1 to 6.35)? On the one hand, the overall BPA is very close to being in the Perennial All Pro category rating, but the greatest team improvement would be at the position of need?

    In the first scenario, I'd take the overall BPA because not only will he upgrade the stronger position more than the player at the position of need, but overall, he's a much better player. In the second scenario, I'd go with the BPA at the position of need, because that player is only rated a little lower than the overall BPA and would be a much bigger upgrade at the position of need. The third scenario would be a tougher call for me. Weighing perhaps a perennial All Pro at a position of strength vs. a big improvement at a position of real need. For me, the positions involved would be the difference maker. If the position of need was a more important position like QB, edge rusher, OT, WR and probably RB, and the position of strength was a lesser one like ILB, #2 CB, S or TE, I'd go with the player at the position of need. If the two are reversed or equal, then the decision gets a lot tougher. In the case of where the Jets are right now, I'd opt for an OL over an edge rusher or anything else with those numbers. How about you?
     
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  7. Jets81

    Jets81 Well-Known Member

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    Which part of my post did you not understand? The part where I said I hope fans can look at things objectively? Or the part where I said I want mods to be heavy handed with troll posts?
     
  8. Bowles Movement

    Bowles Movement Active Member

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    I think Darnold was bpa at number 3 and probably at number 1
     
  9. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

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    If I misunderstood anything, I'm apparently not the only one, judging by the response to my posts. You now have the perfect opportunity to clarify exactly what it is that makes you call for a heavy handed approach from the moderators and what it is you'd like to see posted and what should be off limits.
     
  10. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    First, I agree that it's a case by case decision and each has to be decided on its on merits.

    That said, to your scenarios, I would go with the BPA of Need in scenario 1 because I would significantly upgrading that spot, whereas adding a slightly better player at an already strong spot isn't going to help me as much.

    For #2, again I would take the BPA at that position.

    For #3 you've thrown several wrinkles in so it's not as clear, but I would probably again go with the BPA at the position of need, unless the overall BPA was for a position of lesser need. For example, let's say next year's BPA was an OG, and Carpenter and Winters do a decent but not great job this year, and the consensus BPA is an OG, AND I could likely get a very strong pass rusher with my 2nd pick, then I might take the BPA. Of course looking at next year in reality as it stands now, barring a trade up, it's highly unlikely that a stud pass rusher would be there with the Jets first 3rd round pick, so I definitely would NOT take BPA in my example. Also of course, while a LT might be a top BPA, its not likely that an OG would be, I'm just using this as an example.

    On balance, and with some case by case exceptions, I still think looking at position of need first for a rebuilding team is the best way to go.
     
  11. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I personally agree, but there were many here who said that there were other players who based upon pure BPA were higher rated, such as Barkley, and Chubb to name two.

    This is why BPA can't simply be used by itself - you need to factor in the position of the player. The greatest pass rusher in the world is NOT as impactful as a stud QB (Assuming both work out in the NFL). And as I said, you also need to factor in the position of greatest need for your team. In this case, drafting Darnold filled both criteria.
     
  12. Pseudo Spike

    Pseudo Spike Member

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    C'mon man you can't tell by the name?!?!?!

     
  13. Jets81

    Jets81 Well-Known Member

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    If that’s the case, then all of you seem to equate being critical with being a troll. One can be objective and critical...I assumed that to be understood. I also assumed that people on a message board would understand what trolling is.

    My mistake.
     
  14. jonnyd

    jonnyd 2007 TGG.com Funniest Poster Award Winner

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    I think people take Mac's BPA mentality ( which I agree with) too far. For instance, do you think he drafted Chad Hansen because he was the very best player left in the 4th round or do you think he drafted him out of positional need?
     
  15. Rollo Tomassi

    Rollo Tomassi Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, he was a compensatory pick at the very end of the 4th round.
     
  16. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for your thoughtful response. You answered exactly as I thought you would, and that's where we differ (but that's ok because no one said that we always have to agree).

    I disagree on scenario #1. The improvement at the strong position with the overall BPA is much better than the improvement at the position of need, where the improvement is only negligible. IMO taking need there would be a mistake.

    There's nothing wrong with looking at position of need and ascertaining the best way to upgrade it, but if one can add a much better player at another position, even a position of strength, and the upgrade would be more than at the position of need, I'm going overall BPA every single time.
     
  17. Pepsiguy5

    Pepsiguy5 Well-Known Member

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    Not to mention his build. Whatever listed heights and weights are for various guys that's fine, but you just look at this kid and he's built like a brick shithouse. Not to say its impossible he'll ever get injured but from just the eye test it looks to me like he can shrug off hits that would break poor McCown in half.

    Hopefully he'll never take a hit but if and when he does he looks like he's at least got that little extra layer of physical protection.
     
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  18. 50ShadesOfGreen

    50ShadesOfGreen Well-Known Member

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    Ah, seeing as you enjoy having an image of a man plowing another man, this must be you!

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

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    Geez, you suck at clarifying things too.

    How about specifics?

    September 11, 2018: Jets record 1-2, total points for 29, total points against 73, total penalties 27, fumbles 5. Major time management blunders 2. Major play calling blunders 2. Timeouts called following clock stoppages 2.

    Poster writes "Bowles sucks, get him out of there!"

    Is that objectivity or trolling?
     
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  20. K'OB

    K'OB 2021 TGG Fantasy Football Champ

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    What a cad.

    Never understand why folk join other teams forums and then do so with two piss taking items, you shouldn't get past a basic check with that name and avatar.

    Anyway, fuck Dan Marino the no rings cunt.

    :D
     
    #80 K'OB, Sep 7, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2018

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