Was the Rebuild a Last-Minute Decision?

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by NCJetsfan, Jun 9, 2017.

?

How Do You Think the Complete Rebuild Came About This Season?

Poll closed Jun 20, 2017.
  1. The plan all along was to go with the complete rebuild in the 3rd season

    11.1%
  2. The plan for the team's future changed during last season & they decided to go w/youth

    27.8%
  3. The plan changed in 2017 when they couldn't sign a good FA QB & Pettyburg showed little progress

    11.1%
  4. Mac convinced Woody that the complete rebuild was necessary during this off season

    38.9%
  5. We're lucky that they had little cap space to bring in new FAs & that forced the change

    11.1%
  6. This is plain and simple a tank job to get Darnold, Allen or another QB in the 2018 draft

    5.6%
  7. I don't think they have a long term plan. They're winging it by the seat of their pants

    11.1%
  8. Other

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Walt White

    Walt White Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2014
    Messages:
    6,681
    Likes Received:
    4,138
    Hmm. With us it's tough to say what the plan was, whether A or B. At this point with the Jets it may well be...

    Plan 9 From Outer Space :eek:

    [​IMG]
     
    #61 Walt White, Jun 15, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2017
  2. Ralebird

    Ralebird Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    14,034
    Likes Received:
    8,637
    Probably just late to work. Everybody's alarm clock fails every now and then. No big deal.
     
    NCJetsfan likes this.
  3. DefenseWinsChampionships

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    5,393
    Likes Received:
    4,238
    The Jets were only a combined 26-38 (.406%) during it's previous 4 seasons leading up to the arrival of Maccagnan.

    Maccagnan knew right then and there.

    That it were time to rebuild his roster from the very moment in which he became GM of the Jets

    And in less than 3 full years; he's done exactly that.

    Which is why despite not even having completed his 3rd full year as Jets GM, there are only 11 current players on this roster left over and who remain from the previous regime.

    Those 11 players are Dakota Dozier, Ben Ijalana, Dexter McDougle, Rontez Miles, Marcus Williams, Wesley Johnson, Brian Winters, Bilal Powell, Quincy Enunwa, Sheldon Richardson and Muhammad Wilkerson and chances are the likes of Dozier, Ijalana and McDougle have no future here whatsoever either.

    So to assume, act as if or even ask/question if Maccagnan's youth movement through a rebuild were a "last minute decision" is just a head scratcher to me.
     
    NYJetsO12 likes this.
  4. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    35,280
    Likes Received:
    28,704
    Mac may have known it, but that's not what he either said or did. Over his first two seasons here, Mac said repeatedly in interviews that the Jets were going to try to be as competitive as possible while trying to upgrade the roster. He called it a "competitive rebuild." In that time draft picks were traded away for older veterans (Brandon Marshall and Fitz). A team that is going with a youth movement and trying to rebuild its roster from day one, doesn't do that. It saves it's draft picks and treats them as being as precious as gold. In fact, they generally try to trade older players for draft picks, and trade down to accumulate more picks.

    A lot of older, more expensive FAs (Revis Cromartie, Skrine, Gilchrist, and Carpenter in 2015, and Clady, Forté, Jenkins, and McLendon in 2016), were signed to upgrade the roster and older Jets FAs were retained (Willie Colon, David Harris, Erin Henderson, Kellen Davis, and Folk). Again, a team that is doing a "complete rebuild" or youth movement doesn't do that. They may sign some younger, cheaper FAs to help upgrade depth, upgrade STs, and to provide some competition and stability, but they don't retain older, expensive FAs and especially don't sign expensive FAs. Now they more or less had to re-sign Fitz because Marshall and Decker were publicly campaigning for Fitz, and I'm positive that Woody wanted him back.

    Finally, there's the great article by Jason LaCanfora at CBS Sports http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/n...ut-they-are-going-to-be-terrible-for-a-while/
    detailing that Woody wasn't buying the "rebuild" in 2015 when it should have begun. He wanted to win "now." He practically ordered Mac (or went around him) to re-sign Revis to such a huge deal. The article also implies that Woody was largely responsible for bringing back Fitz last season. Bowles and Rodgers also clearly didn't care so much about developing younger players. They only cared about who they thought gave the team the best chance to win "now." Mac doesn't exist in a vacuum. He doesn't have control over the Jets' decisions personally. The Jets have a 3-headed triumvirate with Woody, Mac and Bowles, and unfortunately, Woody's vote counts more than Mac's and Bowles' together.

    Hopefully, this clarifies things for you and you don't have to scratch your head any more. :p

    [​IMG]
     
  5. BleedingGreen55

    BleedingGreen55 Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2004
    Messages:
    981
    Likes Received:
    112
    I completely agree with you. I don't understand how so many people just don't get it.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    NCJetsfan likes this.
  6. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2009
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    Pretty sure I read somewhere that we were going to have over 80. I just did a quick check on overthecap.com and in 2018, Jets are slated to have 66,331.682...but if you cut a few players, which I think will happen, I can easily see us reaching 80.

    Cutting Skrine would net us 6 mil in cap savings, cutting Matt Forte would get us 3 in cap savings, cutting Wilkerson (if he has a bad season) would result in 11 in cap savings. We also have to take into account that the cap will likely increase next season by a few million. So 80 million is not out of question.
     
  7. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    35,280
    Likes Received:
    28,704
    Wilkerson won't be cut. He had a tendon issue last year. He wasn't dogging it. He's already said that he's gonna bounce back in a big way and be very aggressive this year. I'm expecting a huge year out of him.
     
    TwoHeadedMonster likes this.
  8. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2009
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    I think he will have a much better year in 2017, but I don't want to take it for granted. I think he was rushed back last season with pressures of getting a big deal. I would love if he stayed on, but it all depends on his production. Either ways, cap wise at leas, Jets can and probably will be major players in the 2018 free agency. Regardless of whether we have our future QB on the roster, or we suck so bad that we get our pick of QB in the draft, Jets can instantly infuse talent into the roster.
     
    NCJetsfan likes this.
  9. The Waterboy

    The Waterboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    8,282
    Likes Received:
    8,460
    I keep seeing everyone thinking the Jets will be a big player in free agency but what if even 10 of the 34 current players on the team, who will be free agents next season, what if they warrant extensions? Enunwa, Claiborne, Carter, Qvale, Johnson, ASJ, Miles, Dozier just to name a few.
    Sure many will be smaller contracts but with a few on the larger side, like Enunwa's is bound to be, it's going to add up quick.
     
    TonyFtLaud likes this.
  10. NCJetsfan

    NCJetsfan Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2013
    Messages:
    35,280
    Likes Received:
    28,704
    Good point. If the Jets are "big" players, I hope it's in terms of how many players they sign rather than going after 2-3 "stars" or big name, high dollar players.
     
  11. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    22,232
    Likes Received:
    12,243
    Mo has a career year every other year. This year should he stay healthy, and be used correctly, I smell 12 to 15 sacks.

    Mo will make some money for a little bit, but by the team Williams needs a new deal, Mo's deal will be through the majority of the large money.
     
    FJF likes this.
  12. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2009
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    I agree.... On a side note, I want to see how Bowles uses Williams, Wilkerson and Richardson at the same time.
     
    101GangGreen101 likes this.
  13. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2009
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    A lot of it depends on how the the players you mentioned actually play. I think out of that group only a few will prob get re-signed. I think Enunwa should be extended now before he has a breakout season and costs a fortune. I think ASJ is going to surprise a few, down 30 pounds, I think he and Leggette (depending on how he develops) can be a really nice TE tandem.

    I'm interested to see how Claiborne plays. He was playing really well last season before getting injured. Even if we have to re-sign a few, we can still sign some premier players. But I don't want the Jets to sign players based on their name, I would prefer if they signed them based on a very detailed analysis of what their production will be over the course of the contract.
     
    NCJetsfan likes this.
  14. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    22,232
    Likes Received:
    12,243
    I am interested as well. To me, if he can't utilize them correctly, I want Bowles gone.
     
  15. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2004
    Messages:
    36,670
    Likes Received:
    14,472
    Mo's deal was not front loaded. Going into year two he has only received $22M of the $86M total. After this year he will have received $36.75M of the $86M total or 43% of the deal. He will still be getting $48.25M over the back 3 years of the deal and his cap hits will remain high at $20M, $18.5M and $19.5M.

    If Mo is a superstar over the next few years the cap hits won't be much of a problem. If he's less than that he's going to be a drag on the cap, since even if you have a lot of cap space the value you get out of each dollar spent determines how well you will perform against the other team's cap reserves over time.
     
    NYJetsO12 likes this.
  16. Br4d

    Br4d 2018 Weeb Ewbank Award

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2004
    Messages:
    36,670
    Likes Received:
    14,472
    Going to a 4 man front is the only way that you can get value out of 3 guys who are all 3T/3-4 DE's. If the Jets are going to stay in 3 man fronts a lot of the time they probably should rotate the 3 guys who play 2 positions to keep them as fresh as possible and minimize the wear and tear on them. Playing Richardson at OLB is a joke. It's a pure Rex move and not only does it hurt the defense on the field but it also takes away development time from the young OLB's that might be a real plus outside instead of just doing time there before they leave.

    The best answer for the Jets is probably to keep Richardson through camp and then trade him for as much as they can get near the end of camp. This will give them insurance on a Mo or Leo injury during camp (or Mo remaining ineffective for the second year, which should be obvious by that point) and it will give the Jets the best market for Richardson as they watch the other rosters to see who has an injury or talent-related shortfall at 3T. Somebody is likely to be in that spot by the end of camp and willing to give up a mid-rounds pick to resolve the issue.
     
    NYJetsO12 and grkmanga31 like this.
  17. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    22,232
    Likes Received:
    12,243
    It's all about the guarantees. Wilkerson's $16.75 million base salary for 2018 is guaranteed for injury only at the time of signing. It becomes fully guaranteed if he is on the roster on the third day of the 2018 league year. Jets can get out of the Mo deal next summer if they feel he isn't worth the money and is a 9M dead hit, it gets considerably lower each year. The next 3 years, there won't be many players for the Jets to resign outside of Quincy, and Leonard Williams. The rest should be on rookie contracts still. His contract won't hinder the Jets at all. We shouldn't be spending every dime and dollar in FA. Follow the Packers model and the Jets will be OK with the cap.

    I think Mo will bounce back big time as long as he's utilized correctly.
     
    FJF likes this.
  18. Chrisiue

    Chrisiue Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2013
    Messages:
    256
    Likes Received:
    317
    Total rebuild as far as I can see came about when Buffalo decided to keep Tyrod Taylor, there was nothing else out there except lost in space Cutler.
    I really do not get the non stop discussion about Harris Decker and Mangold being gone as a sign of total rebuild,
    Harris turned into a first down linebacker and that's it, second and more than 3 they were going to throw to the guy he could not cover, Decker coming off two surgeries and expecting 25 weeks of football is a pipe dream, let him hangout in Nashville while his wife makes records, Mangold, I hate to see he is not there but injuries at this age are very hard to get over when they are in the foot and legs while trying to navigate 300 lbs. on top of them.
    Theeir is not much left on this team to get excited over but all we have to do is go back draft after draft to see why.
     
    TonyFtLaud likes this.
  19. 101GangGreen101

    101GangGreen101 2018 Thread of the Year Award Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2008
    Messages:
    22,232
    Likes Received:
    12,243
    They shouldn't be, just because you have the $$$ doesn't mean you should spend it.
     
    TonyFtLaud and NCJetsfan like this.
  20. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2009
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    2,462
    Well, look at this this way. If Hack amounts to being a legit QB, or we suck so bad we land Darnold or Rosen, Jets will actually have someone who has a legitimate future at QB. You do not want a new QB, or young QB, playing on a team that constantly loses. That's how you ruin players and that's how you stunt the possible growth of your team as a whole. I'm not advocating spending money on players because they're popular, I want the Jets to look at players for what they'll produce, for how long, and whether they will fit in the locker room.
     
    NYJetsO12 likes this.

Share This Page