Decision to Punt on 4th and 7

Discussion in 'New York Jets' started by JethroTull, Sep 10, 2017.

  1. Royal Tee

    Royal Tee Girls juss wanna have fun
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    But the 2 pt failed...and you're saying that because it did it gave the JETS a BETTER Chance?
    lol, ok

    Last time i'll try this, just for you.
    Would you rather have to score on
    1 possession
    or
    2 possessions to tie/win the game in the 4Q?

    By failing the 2pt it forced the JETS to need 2 possessions in the 4th
    Simple Logic
     
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  2. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    I was more pissed off with the 2 point conversion. Its to early, and took away momentum. If we kicked the extra point we would have been down one score the whole fourth quarter . Would have probably lost anyway because we suck but once again our head coach still does not know how to manage a football game and continually makes the wrong decision. This guy is worse then Herm, Mangini and Rex when it comes to decision making.
     
    #42 sec314, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
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  3. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    You never go for 2 the first chance. You try to extend the game and only go for 2 when you have to at the end of the game. If you are down 15 points with lets say 4 minutes left in fourth qtr. and score a TD you don't go for 2 because you would be down 9. You take the one. You hope to stop the other team, score a TD and go for 2 and tie the game. Obviously either way you lose, if you don't get it, but the coaches job is to extend the game and give his team a chance at the end. Man that's football 101.
     
    #43 sec314, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
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  4. Jake

    Jake Well-Known Member

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    Ridiculous. I'm trying to like this guy but this kind of shit keeps happening.
     
  5. JethroTull

    JethroTull 2018 Least Knowledgeable Poster

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    Is there a community college near Florham Park that offers a course in Football 101 that we can send TB to?
     
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  6. truthbtold

    truthbtold Well-Known Member

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    It's astonishing how many people just can't absorb this. And it's frightening that our coach can't.
    It was the wrong decision ... it showed no grasp of knowing how to manage a football game ... and there's not another coach in the league who would have done it. Even worse ... with OUR offense, you know that being down two scores in the 4th would be a death sentence, and would completely change the way the 4th quarter would be played, and he still did it. Simply incredible.
     
  7. tomdeb

    tomdeb Well-Known Member

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    He is just a bad coach, pure and simple. The jets have the worst roster, coach, and GM in the NFL. Yes, I include the GM--his drafts have been piss poor (devin smith, Hack, Darren Lee), bad contracts to revis fitz and wilk, totally ignored OL in draft, and he should have talked woody into firing bowles last year! The jets NEED a new GM/coach who knows how to assemble and coach a team.
     
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  8. grkmanga31

    grkmanga31 Well-Known Member

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    I can't really argue against that. Macc has made plenty of mistakes, and Bowles is still Bowles. I'd be shocked if they're back next season
     
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  9. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    Don't twist what I said. I said at the time Bowles made the call going for 2 helped the Jets chance of winning. Once we failed, our odds of winning went down, but Bowles didn't know we would fail when he called for it. And I'll say again your one possession argument is bullshit because being down 8 isn't really a one possession game. We would still have to convert a 2 pointer to tie it, and there's no reason to think making it would be any more likely than the first time around.

    Also, what if the Bills didn't score again? They aren't world-beaters on offense, they could easily go 15+ minutes without scoring. Then kicking the extra point would have left us down by 1, we would have lost by a point, and you'd be screaming at Bowles for not going for 2 when he could have. Don't deny it.
     
    #49 HomeoftheJets, Sep 11, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
  10. Jonathan_Vilma

    Jonathan_Vilma Well-Known Member

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    That could be true for some. I'm not a fan of going for two until it's time to try to win the game though. This isn't the first time Bowles has chased points like a drunk dude at a bar at 3AM chases tail.
     
  11. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I completely agree that Bowles's decision to punt with 4 minutes left and down two scores was idiotic, as was the decision to go for two in the 3rd qtr. What more evidence do Macc/Woody need to get rid of this guy? But we're going to have to suffer the whole season because they didn't fire him at the end of the last one.

    But what's ignored in the blinding stupidity of Bowles's game "management" is that the vaunted "D" that has been lavished upon for years couldn't stop the Little Sisters of Mercy! According to the players, they were fully aware of what the Bills would try to do, and they practiced all week to stop it, and yet they couldn't! That, to me, is the really frightening thing about this team: it's supposed best unit, the defense, couldn't execute against one of the weakest teams in the NFL! For all the blame Bowles deserves for his stupid game mis-management, Macc certainly deserves at least that much for assembling this collection of "talent".

    The "good" news is that this should cinch the firing of both Macc and Bowles to make way - HOPEFULLY - for some guys who actually know how to construct a winning football team.
     
  12. Attackett

    Attackett Well-Known Member

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    Best thing for Jets and their future is to keep Bowles the entire season. So yes the decision to punt down 9 was mind numbingly stupid and going for 2 too early was a bad decision too.

    In the end who cares? Let the guy keep making bad decisions and after the season we can bring in a real coach and Bowles can go back to being a DC.
     
  13. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    I see your logic, and with successful teams, I would agree with you, but the Jets had spent the whole game being almost punchless, but at this point they had a chance to have momentum give them a jolt and maybe enable them to carry that momentum forward. But instead they had the wind let out of their sails when they failed to convert - that was a momentum-killer. Good teams might well have been able to overcome that - of course good teams probably wouldn't have been in that spot against a weak team like the Bills - but not an anemic team like the Jets. So what I'm saying is, "by the book", Bowles wasn't necessarily wrong to try for the two, but when gauged against the chances of the Jets in particular, it was the wrong move. And if you say he was simply taking a calculated risk, then why didn't he use that same "gambler's mentality" with 4 minutes left in desperation time? His inconsistency shows that he doesn't have a grasp on how to manage an entire team for an actual game - simply put, he's a failure as a HC.
     
  14. ColoradoContrails

    ColoradoContrails Well-Known Member

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    My brain says "YES!!!!", but my heart says "Nooooooooo!!!"
     
  15. johnny

    johnny Well-Known Member

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    What's amazing to me that people are complaining about the 2 point conversion in a thread about the fourth down punt. The punt was by far and away the bigger issue. Deciding to punt the ball basically put the game out of reach. No question about it. In my mind the chances of getting the first down (maybe 30-40% - 4th and 7 near midfield isn't that bad) is about the same as a three and out against the Bills after the punt and the rewards were much higher.

    The decision with the 2 point conversion can be argued back and forth. Personally, I don't have a problem with it. If you fail you are down by 2 rather than 1 - still within a field goal. Even if you kick the extra point you are still going to have to try a 2 point conversion later if the Bills were to score a TD (which they did). To me there isn't much of a difference in going for a 2 point conversion at the end of the third quarter or at the end of the game - assuming you happen to score a TD (which the Jets did not do). Unless the percentage of third quarter conversions are much less than fourth quarter conversions it really does matter in my book. In my mind - any time you have a ~50% chance to tie the score later in the game (especially with an offense that is as challenged as the Jets) that decision can't be faulted. IMHO late in the third quarter is late enough.

    I guess I wouldn't have taken Bowles to task if he went for the XP rather than the 2 point conversion, but I am not going castigate him for going for the 2 point conversion at that point either. One question for all the XP fans ... If the Jets had scored the TD 2-3 minutes into the 4th quarter (vs. 2 minutes left in the third) will you still have been screaming for an XP rather than a conversion attempt? If not, then is 4-5 minutes of game time that much of a difference to get woreked up about?
     
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  16. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    Being down 8 isn't really a one possession game? I really have nothing else to say, you said it all. Nice!!!!
     
  17. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    Assuming you're being sarcastic, being down 8 is a one possession game if you make the 2 point conversion after you score a TD. Otherwise it's a 2 possession game.
     
  18. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    Hey I never said Bowles knew what he was doing, even a broken clock is right twice a day. :)
     
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  19. sec314

    sec314 Well-Known Member

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    The two point conversion came first and changed the game way before this stupid decision and while I feel it was pussy and stupid to punt there is no numbers to argue this decision. Its purely you play to win and he played to lose. Going for 2 at that point was a numbers thing that's black and white so that's why I choose to argue that. Both were bad decisions made by a bad head coach
     
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  20. HomeoftheJets

    HomeoftheJets Well-Known Member

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    We weren't going up against an elite offense, the Bills could have easily failed to score a TD for the rest of the game. In which case it would have been time to win the game when Bowles went for 2. There were times when Bowles stupidly chased points, this isn't one of them.
     

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